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Handhelds Hardware

AT&T Crippling BlackBerry for iPhone? 211

0xdeadbeef writes "BlackBerryCool got a tip that not only was AT&T removing GPS functionality from their version of the BlackBerry 8820, they're doing it so it won't show up the iPhone. While carriers crippling phones to stop them from competing with pay-per-use services is nothing new, this might be the first time they've done it to make their other products seem less diminished."
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AT&T Crippling BlackBerry for iPhone?

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  • sigh... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 18, 2007 @04:55PM (#20279565)
    The new AT&T feels alot like the old AT&T.
  • Re:sigh... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by DoraLives ( 622001 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @04:57PM (#20279587)
    > The new AT&T feels alot like the old AT&T.

    Trust me on this one ..... it's worse.
  • by Technician ( 215283 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @05:03PM (#20279673)
    Many carriers think they are a monopoly and don't want to have their low end rob the profit from the high end.

    They are forgetting something. There is competition. They should strive to make all of their products and services more valuable to consumers.

    Here is what we have so far..
    1 An i-phone which is cool who's bill comes in a box shipped by UPS Oh and by the way is has a monopoly carrier.

    2 A Blackberry. They are obtainable from several carriers, but AT&T cripples them worse than other carriers.

    3 A Blackberry on another carrier.

    4.. The rest of the market

    If you avoid #1 due to the carrier issues and monster bills, you are now likely to avoid #2 for both the service and carrier reputation. Just what were they thinking? They don't hold a monopoly on Blackberries.

    http://www.bbhub.com/2006/09/18/rating-the-major-b lackberry-carrier-retailers-who-gets-it-and/ [bbhub.com]
  • by intx13 ( 808988 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @05:04PM (#20279679) Homepage
    I'm not so sure why AT&T would want to do this. Even though I wouldn't think that the iPhone and the Blackberry compete directly, at least prior to this decision AT&T sold one popular device with GPS functionality. Why they would change so that they now sell no devices (at the iPhone/Blackberry level) with GPS capabilities?

    I could understand if Apple wanted this to happen... but how does this help AT&T? AT&T doesn't/shouldn't care if people are buying Blackberries over iPhones on the basis of GPS, so long as the Blackberry comes from AT&T. If they believed that GPS was the tipping point, those customers are now buying nothing from AT&T.

    Doesn't seem so smart to me.
  • how retarted. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Lumpy ( 12016 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @05:04PM (#20279685) Homepage
    The GPS in every cellphone I have ever tried was incredibly crappy anyways. The Blackberry GPs's dont get a fix unless you carefully hold them up in the air in an open field, Nextel GPS phones also suck horribly. The iPhone dies not have a GPS for two very good reasons. 1. it's a metal casing phone. 2. GPS modules in phones simply do not work so they left it out. The cheapie Magellan Gold GPS I got for $89.00 on ebay kicks the crud out of every single GPS enabled phone I have ever seen. and yes I have seen lots of them. They can not get a GPS fix from inside your pocket or on your hip, they never work in newer cars as the glare film and other tratements make the windshield electrically conductive so it blocks RF signals.

    I am sure they are disabling the GPS simply because the GPS sucks. The is the same company that 3 years ago refused to allow phones on it's network that did not have GPS's in them.
  • by jht ( 5006 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @05:09PM (#20279729) Homepage Journal
    As long as carriers dictate what phones do or don't do, this is no big deal - it's just typical. I suspect the GPS functionality lockdown has nothing to do with iPhone, it's probably just that AT&T wants to sell their Telenav service and make money from it. The iPhone really doesn't compete in the same segment as Blackberries of any stripe, and they sell at a non-subsidized price - GPS or the lack thereof isn't going to make a hell of a lot of difference in the Blackberry/iPhone purchase decision.

    It's not like this is rare. Heck, Verizon's locked down the OBEX capabilities on most of their Bluetooth phones so they can sell their wireless sync service. Even Apple had to bite the bullet here - since there's no subsidy on the phone and Apple pockets all the money, don't you think they'd love to sell unlocked iPhones that would work on every GSM carrier? Or sell CDMA models through Verizon or Sprint? Of course they would. But to get AT&T to sell 'em and modify the network (build out EDGE capacity and add the Visual Voicemail system) they had to agree to a multi-year exclusivity deal.

    So basically, the 8820 being modified because of Apple? I call BS. And if you want your Blackberry and you want it on AT&T, find yourself an unlocked version and just DIY. It's GSM, you can do that. It'll be unsubsidized, but at least that way it'll be a fair fight with the iPhone.

    Wait - even though iPhone is unsubsidized it's still locked. Never mind!
  • by Albanach ( 527650 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @05:28PM (#20279891) Homepage

    No, GSM is not universally the same. There are at least 3 GSM bands (frequencies escape me). North America has one, Europe another, and (I think) the Middle East has the third.

    The rest of the world uses 900 and 1800MHz for GSM. The US uses two different frequencies, 850 and 1900.
     
    Most phones sold in the Europe are tri band or quad band these days, covering all the frequencies needed to roam internationally. I've happily been using various UK phones in the US since 2002, and roaming in Europe and Africa man times before then.
     
    You are right though, that just because you have a compatible phone, networks can still play unfair. Even your home network when you see roaming costs, like Vodafone UK charging $20/Mb for roaming data!
  • by Espectr0 ( 577637 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @05:59PM (#20280105) Journal
    It isn't pretty in all of the rest of the world either. In latin america, all phones are locked to the carrier that provides them. While they don't cripple the phones as much as verizon (my v3 came with all features enabled), we can't choose carriers. GSM doesn't mean that the phone is free from carrier lockdown.
  • Re:Wow (Score:4, Insightful)

    by godawful ( 84526 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @06:12PM (#20280189)
    I thought it was AT&T hindering the device not apple, so why do they need to be less paranoid?

    Actually this all seems silly to me. Silly if true, I should say. I bought an iphone because I liked it, some other phone having gps isn't going to make me like it less.

    Posted from my iPhone
  • by smittyoneeach ( 243267 ) * on Saturday August 18, 2007 @06:14PM (#20280199) Homepage Journal
    Screw the furniture. Threaten not to use their products, and you've got their attention. Recall, there had been civilization prior to the advent of the cell phone...
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday August 18, 2007 @06:14PM (#20280207)
    I've never heard of anyone I know owning one.
    I've never heard of anyone I know even talking about buying one.
    I've never seen anyone walking around with one.

    The sales figures for the phone so far are embarrassingly low even for a product that you would have thought hundreds of thousands of Mac fans with huge amounts of disposable income would have bought without hesitation.

    I can't imagine AT&T doing anything like this for a marketplace flop like the iPhone.

  • by way2trivial ( 601132 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @06:28PM (#20280297) Homepage Journal
    people were MORE civilized prior to the advent of the cellphone.
  • Poppycock (Score:2, Insightful)

    by TechnicolourSquirrel ( 1092811 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @07:03PM (#20280593)
    This is obvious nonsense. AT&T has no financial incentive to steer people away from BlackBerries (quite the opposite, in fact, BlackBerry service plans are more expensive than the standard iPhone plans), and if an agreement with Apple is forcing them to do it, then that agreement would likely be illegal and probably doesn't exist.
  • Re:Wow (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Nixoloco ( 675549 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @07:11PM (#20280651)

    Apple need to get less paranoid.
    You mean AT&T need to get less paranoid.
  • by Actually, I do RTFA ( 1058596 ) on Saturday August 18, 2007 @07:45PM (#20280923)

    I live in America. I have an uncrippled phone, because I opted to buy my own. I could either buy an uncrippled phone, or let the telco subsidize my purchase, but they want to cripple the phone so I would end up paying more money in the long term. Ultimately, I decided that to replace my uncrippled phone with one crippled in ways I didn't care about, but that was superior in other ways.

    Let's be clear, you can bitch about the loss of rights companies force on you. Just be prepared to pay full-price for those things. Alternatively, you can buy a phone where they cripple the bluetooth, just use USB to move things, and say, "Hey, bluetooth isn't worth $150 to me to buy an uncrippled version."

    It's actually more freedom in the US.

  • Re:sigh... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by PopeRatzo ( 965947 ) * on Saturday August 18, 2007 @10:28PM (#20282223) Journal

    The new AT&T feels alot like the old AT&T.
    I take your point, but there's something new in this type of behavior that we're seeing in all sorts of corporations. Instead of the traditional "free market" belief that "you give the customer what they want" and "supply and demand", there's a sense that we're the ones who are obliged to give the corporations what they want.

    Let's face it, it's been some years now since consumers had anything like the power wielded by corporations. They pay the government and the government works for them. We, in turn, exist to give the corporations what they want, which is profits. Our desires don't enter into the equation.

    The "free market", if it ever existed, is a deeply flawed concept. No matter how its done, the story always ends the same way. We are the consumables.
  • by frusengladje ( 990955 ) on Sunday August 19, 2007 @12:00AM (#20282881)

    And in the mean time, in the rest of the world, crippled phones DON'T EXIST. Because the phone you use is independent from the carrier. Welcome to open standards (GSM).
    You do realize you can just use pretty much any old GSM phone on AT&T's network don't you? Or Tmobile's for that matter.
  • by Jaime2 ( 824950 ) on Sunday August 19, 2007 @12:17AM (#20282979)
    So.... nearly everyone has one?

    I have yet to see an iPhone in the wild. I work in IT with 20 geeks that have well paying jobs. I have a lot of gadget freaks in my family and there are many blackberries at family events. Yet somehow, none of them have iPhones.

    BTW, my personal observations are just as representative as yours. That is to say, neither of our observation reflect the market penetration of the iPhone.
  • by foniksonik ( 573572 ) on Sunday August 19, 2007 @10:58AM (#20285783) Homepage Journal
    As a person who uses Apple products... I'd gladly purchase a non-Apple product if I could find one which was worth my money. I've tried buying other brands, non-brands, etc. and always end up with buyer's remorse... Apple just makes good products.

    Regarding TFA... AT&T is free to do what they want with their products, though I don't understand why they'd choose this option. iPhone is a consumer product, Blackberry is a Business User product. They are targeted at two separate and distinct markets. Who cares if they have different features, it's expected.
  • by PopeRatzo ( 965947 ) * on Sunday August 19, 2007 @04:41PM (#20287775) Journal
    But look at how readily Apple, now experiencing some measure of success, can ignore the desires of their own customers. Do you know how many consumers want to buy OSX to run on their own custom-built hardware?

    How about how many iPod users want to be able to listen to FLAC files, or be able to use their iPods the way that they want them without violating the end user license. Speaking of end-user licenses, those are some of the best examples of the way the free market has betrayed consumers. Now, we buy a product and we have to sign a quasi-legal document that tells us how we are allowed to use the product, which we NOW OWN.

    I'm sorry, fans. Apple make some very cool products, but as a corporation they are just as uncaring about what their customers want as any HMO or oil company. We're supposed to buy the products they want us to buy instead of the ones we want to buy, and we're supposed to be grateful.

    It really is the free market itself that failed. No matter how you shake it, the free market is always going to coalesce around powerful entities, who will increase their power and limit our choices. All free markets are doomed to end in commercial authoritarianism, with a few rich people and lots and lots of sub-middle class workers. That's exactly what's happening now.
  • by PopeRatzo ( 965947 ) * on Sunday August 19, 2007 @04:52PM (#20287815) Journal

    Phone carriers are oligopolies. They price accordingly. It's not a free market -- legislators know that, the industry knows that, everyone seems to know that except slashdot readers. (Not a flame, its just true.)
    Of course phone carriers are not free markets. But notice what those carriers start to cry when people ask for some assurance that access will remain open to these strategic resources: "We don't need Net Neutrality laws because The Free Market will sort out all the problems.

    We're supposed to trust them to behave the laws of free markets when it suits them, but when we point out that they're not serving us as consumers, we hear your nonsense about how they aren't really bound by the laws of free markets because they aren't really corporations, but "industrial organizations".

    A half-literate sixth grader can see that's all so much bullshit, but the free market radicals that write the economics articles and show up on television telling us that the current economy is "booming" don't have a clue.

    We are the consumables, and it's only getting worse. There have been times in our nation's past when we've taken big business to the woodshed and taught them some lessons. My great grandfather was one of the iron-headed union guys that helped workers organize to a point where they could even out the field a bit, and he had the scars across his skull to prove it. It's long past overdue for us to do it again. Ronald Reagan started the most recent spate of hatred of the working class in America, and George Bush has put in the most recent knives. It'll take a Democratic administration or two before we get back to anything like balance, but it will happen.

    Remember, it's the decades that there was a balance and mutual respect between big business and labor when our economy was doing the best. Nowadays, we hear about what a great economy we have, but it's really only good if you're a member of the owner class. If you're a worker, you have been repeatedly and brutally violated over the last 6 years.
  • by ppp ( 218671 ) on Sunday August 19, 2007 @09:53PM (#20289413) Homepage
    I own one, my brother owns one, my mother has one, my father has one. My boss has one, my 2 best friends each have one. You can't go outside without seeing people using them. Its hardly a marketplace flop; initial sales projections were off, and they are selling quite nicely.

    I don't have one, niether of my brothers has one, my mother doesn't have one. My boss doesn't have one, none of my best friends have one. In fact, I have yet to see *anyone* using one while outside. However, I realize that this is strictly empirical data, so I'm not going to judge its sales success that way that you seem to have done.

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