S3 Standby State Done Right 216
For Earth Day, Cameron Butterfield has written in with a pointer to his article on how to get your Windows PC into S3 sleep, and why you want to. It covers the question of how to take advantage of this extremely low-power mode even when your machine is an "always on" file server, remote desktop, or VNC server.
Also available on Linux (Score:4, Informative)
The documentation is probably on your own computer at:
Re:And Linux? (Score:5, Informative)
dumppo.exe the Microsoft Power Tool (Score:5, Informative)
Re:network broadcast traffic (Score:4, Informative)
Or it does for me. Even if the computer is alone on the router. It seems my router occasionally broadcasts something and wakes up all my computers.
I've switched to using the magic packet alternative. The only problem is that since my server PC is behind my router, I have to SSH into the router and sent the magic packet from there. ICKY.
I hear other routers (mine is a Linksys WRT54GS) will let you WOL remotely. Normally, you just send your magic packet to the router and set up the router to convert it to a broadcast.
If I remember correctly, a magic packet is just a packet with the correct header and the client's MAC address broadcast to the network.
Re:Laptops? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:S3 and MCE (Score:4, Informative)
Bad Assumption (Score:4, Informative)
* Power bills are generally measured in kilowatt hours or "kW/h"s. Power rates might be as much as $0.12 per kW/h
* Our total cost of having the computer on 24/7 for the month in this scenario would be as follows:
*
That said, it is a good article on how to keep the "instant-on" without using excess power.
Re:CPUIDLE (Score:3, Informative)
Re:FreeBSD (Score:4, Informative)
All available options can be listed by running "sysctl -a hw.acpi" and included in
If you need to unload modules or any other action before suspending, see
That should be everything you need. Either your hardware will work, or it won't. In the latter case, strip your system down to nothing but video, and try different video cards. Then add a piece at a time to see what's causing problems.
Re:What about wireless ? (Score:3, Informative)
At least at one point, I found one 802.11 adapter or chipset that supported OnNow-style [microsoft.com] wakeup, but I don't know whether drivers supported that.
You'd have to keep the radio on, though, which means there's some power you can't save.
That's probably more of a chipset issue than a protocol/PHY issue, so I'm not sure there'd be any chanages in 802.11n - unless there's some radio-layer changes to allow the receiver to run in a low-power mode capable of receiving a wakeup indication.
Re:S3 and MCE (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Calculations are a bit off (Score:3, Informative)
400 watts has got to be way off.
Re:And Linux? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:dumppo.exe the Microsoft Power Tool (Score:4, Informative)
The biggest downside of S3 sleep is that about 1 out of every 200 recovers or thereabouts it completely fails to come back, thought that's probably a mainboard issue more than an OS or technology issue.
Oh, and a great little helper app if you use S3 is WakeUpOnStandBy [dennisbabkin.com]. It allows you to configure a machine to "come alive" at scheduled times, even from an S3 sleep (apparently the BIOS supports configured wake-up times, and this app knows to tell it to wake up accordingly just as going to sleep). Very helpful little app -- I have my PC set to come alive in the morning when I know I'll be remoting in.
Oh, and rather than waking up on all network traffic, as the article recommends, it's far better to wake up on WakeOnLan packets. There are lots of resources out there for that.
Re:want a "file transfer" powerdown mode. (Score:3, Informative)
No you don't, and in fact if you mount your filesystem read-only, or noatime, and run noflushd your hard drives can spin down indefinitely as long as your dataset fits in memory. I used to get 8-9 hours out of the battery on my PowerBook G3 using this method and low screen brightness.
Of course, if you are writing to files and you do this and then lose power, you lose data... But you could store the files you are working on in flash to avoid this.
Re: S3 Standby State Done Right (Score:4, Informative)
Works just fine for me. Probably because I installed the udpate mentioned in the resolution section of the article sometime last year.
Re:Calculations are a bit off (Score:1, Informative)
average centrino laptops consume about 25W in idle.
Re:want a "file transfer" powerdown mode. (Score:3, Informative)
You mean something like this?
http://docs.info.apple.com/jarticle.html?path=Mac
Just a snippet from that page:
400 watts is high (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Calculations are a bit off (Score:4, Informative)
NOTE: All the figures above are *not* including losses in the PSU. A modern PSU should be about 7 5% efficient, so increase the above by 1/3 to make them comparable to the 400W number in the article.
kWh (Score:1, Informative)
Energy is measured in kWh (or kilowatt-hours), which is one kilowatt of power used for the length of one hour.
Nice FUD (Score:5, Informative)
Oh yeah.
Bill Gate's memo
That's an interesting email from 1999. Myself, I've been known to send emails to the tone of "how can we prevent the competition from leeching on our multi-million dollar R&D investment with our technology partners", but OK.
Would you like to point me to the follow up email from Eric Rudder that says "Hi Bill - As you requested, we've made the ACPI extensions specific to Windows so no one else can implement them. Cheers!" I can't seem to find it.
Oh, wait - here's ACPIfor Linux [sourceforge.net] and ACPI for FreeBSD [freebsd.org]. Indeed, here's a quote from the WP entry:
Now, ACPI has its shortcomings. It's complicated. It might not be your ideal of a standard. But it is an open standard, which Linux indeed implements. It might be broken in some ways in Linux as it is in Windows, but implemented it is. It's an important standard because it takes hardware out of the equation, which is important for a general OS that's supposed to support a wide range of it.
I still use APM for the most part
Really? That's also a Microsoft-defined standard [wikipedia.org] (along with Intel):
Is that standard "shit" as well? And if you all these standards from Microsoft are "shit", then why do you use them at all? You use Linux, right? Why don't you come up with your own standard and give it to the free software world so they can stop using all these "shit" open standards that Microsoft has bothered to make open for anyone to use? Which reminds me, I'd love to see that other email about ACPI I mentioned. Thanks.
To see available Sleep modes from Windows Prompt (Score:5, Informative)
powercfg -a
Works for both XP and Vista. Tells you what's available and what's not (S1, S2, S3,...) Vista tells you why something isn't support.
Got info from this page [tech-recipes.com]
Re:And Linux? (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Bad Assumption (Score:3, Informative)
Incidentally I have two PCs (with >85% efficiency PSUs) and a 19" CRT monitor plugged through a power-meter right now and they are drawing 510W total, and 425W if I turn off the monitor.
One of the PCs is a dual socket A machine with cpus that won't go below 60C despite some really powerful air cooling, and the other is an AMD A64-X2 3800+ with ATI X1900XTX. Both are fairly beefy by modern standards, and from previous tests they draw about the same power (so about 210W each). If I had cheap power-supplies in these PCs (eg qTec Gold-painted triple-fan 650W) then I would be using their estimated 400W per pc, but as I went for quality (in this case Tagan 480W) I can run two pcs for that.
Thankfully I only run one of these PCs 24/7, so it costs me about $210 per year for that one, and about 1/3 of that for the other.
If you have a crap power-supply now, then you can save the cost of a new, good one in about 6 months in the electricity you use (if you have your pc on 24/7).
Re:Nice FUD (Score:3, Informative)
- DSDT's are buggy (go figure)
- The common method for fixing a broken DSDT is to patch it after the machine has booted via some driver
Microsoft has troubles with vendors who don't care much about suspend resume functionality.The solution isn't to go out and make yet another spec that vendors wont follow intelligently. The solution is vertical integration. Apple does it, and they can know everything they want to about their hardware. And open source software like Linux also offers the potential to do so. Dell potentially has the tools to make their Linux offering compete. I've been hoping one of the Linux laptop vendors springing up would move towards speccing their own laptops but it hasn't quite happened yet (that I know of).
Re:network broadcast traffic (Score:2, Informative)
A "broadcast" package is not a package with a single specific receiver, so why would a machine in S3 mode wake up when it detects a broadcast package? The whole point is to make sure the machine only wakes up from LAN access when there is traffic directed specifically for that interface/address?
Re:And Linux? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Nice FUD (Score:3, Informative)
Re:APM Sucks too. (Score:4, Informative)
Once you're done getting an education, I'd like for you to explain how "M$" allegedly sabotaged ACPI on Linux. You pointed [slashdot.org] to an eight-year old email from Bill Gates that, if anything, proves Microsoft did not do anything to impact the implementation of ACPI in Linux. Seriously, just in case your FSF distortion field is turned up too high, that's exactly what you are proving by linking to that email. You have ACPI in Linux. It might be as broken as it is on Windows, but you have it. You realize that, yes? God, please tell me you realize that?