Sony and Sharp Backing LCD TVs Over Plasma? 249
LostCluster writes "Several reports out of Toyko are indicating that Sony intends on dropping out of the plasma TV business and ramping up productions of LCD TVs instead. Meanwhile rumors have it that Sharp is planning on investing US$1.9 billion on an LCD production plant."
Sony deny it (BBC link) (Score:5, Informative)
BBC claims Sony is denying it... (Score:5, Informative)
Auntie Beeb [bbc.co.uk] claims that Sony are denying reports: it sounds as though industry analysts may be describing what Sony should do, rather than reporting what Sony is doing.
Re:Will this bring prices down? (Score:5, Informative)
3 new LCD plants have opened that i'm aware of so we may get lucky and see that saturation..
HOWEVER, Buyer-Be-Ware - Not all tv's are the same. Look at those resulutions, refresh rates and pixel speeds before forking out the cash. Make sure you only buy from a place with a satisfaction guarantee & warranty.
Re:Not profitable? (Score:4, Informative)
They're both nice things to have (Score:5, Informative)
The sensible person, of course, will wait 3 years and then pick up whatever is the best techology then, for a much nicer price. Of course, I did promise myself my next TV would be at least 40" on the diagonal, and plasmas are much better at these sizes than LCD TVs which generally top out at 30" for a lot of money.
Re:Why? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:LCD over Plasma? No brainer... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Not profitable? (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Why? (Score:2, Informative)
I like to think of plasmas like old CRTs that you really needed a screen saver for.
Re:Why? (Score:4, Informative)
The curent plasmas have pushed that time closer to nine years. Even though the 'two-year dimming plague' affected only plasmas that were made more than two or three years ago, the stigma lives on.
Re:LCD over Plasma? No brainer... (Score:3, Informative)
Plus the gases diminish in quality over time. If you look at a Plasma that has been in use for two years next to the very same plasma tv you'll see the difference. I've done this very same thing. Plus the gases don't work as well in higher regions such as Colorado.
No problem with LCDs in Colorado and also no problems with burn in or quality decreasing over age. Also LCD TVs are lighter. A plasma TV weighs in at 60-100 LBs (average).
Re:Will this bring prices down? (Score:4, Informative)
This was improved a couple of years ago. Current plasma tv's will last roughly a decade before reaching the half-dimmed point.
Re:LCD over Plasma? No brainer... (Score:5, Informative)
The one-chip DLP method of displaying of an image basically paints the red, green and blue color parts of the image at different times rather than at the same time like most other display techs. This bothers some people, it is noticible to a lot of people if they move your eyes much when there are bright objects on a dark background. Some people feel nauseous because of this effect. It has been improved with faster color wheels but a lot of displays still use 2x speed color wheels.
Life Testing (Score:5, Informative)
Well, it's an estimate, but an educated one. At the manufacturing plants we do life testing where we burn in the test units for a specified amount of time (usually three months or more) often under some extreme environment. This is the routine life testing and doesn't even consider the tests which the original design models go through. Anyway, from what we learn from the life tests, we can estimate how long the sets will last in the consumer's homes. 15 years might be a bit optimistic, but it's not a bad estimate. In all honestly, I would put it closer to 10-12 years.
And yes, I make plasma TVs.
Re:Not likely to happen (Score:1, Informative)
Do not go plasma. (Score:5, Informative)
Plasmas are good money makers because the bigger ones are not really that more expensive to make. Getting under 42" actually costs more. LCDs are the opposite.
I have the old fashioned project 5-CRT based HDTV widescreen and have looked at LCD based solution. My opinion, unless you just have to have it NOW wait till later in the year as the prices have been dropping a lot lately and can only get better.
Some reasons why Plasmas are still good (Score:2, Informative)
- Display size. Plasma is available in much larger sizes, and is cheaper at the 42" size than LCD.
- Black level. Good plasma (i.e. those based on Panasonic glass) panels display a darker black. LCD blacks often are very bright gray - especially noticable when viewing in a dark room.
- Viewing angle. LCDs usually offer a narrower viewing angle than plasma displays.
LCDs do have several advantages, IMO:
- Resolution. Some displays even support 1080p resolution.
- Less prone to burn-in. I have heard that over a long period of time, the dyes in LCD panels can burn in, but it is such a long time it is not a factor for most users.
- Lower power consumption and heat.
Re:Sony deny it (BBC link) (Score:3, Informative)
"It was discovered on the 20th that Sony is considering reducing the scale of its plasma TV manufacturing and sales business. There is also the possibility that it will withdraw entirely from the market next year. Currently Sony manufactures and sells plasma, LCD and rear-projection types of slim TVs, but with the continued increase in size of LCD screens, it is looking at concentrating its business resources on LCD and rear-projection units, thereby increasing its competitiveness in the market.
Slim TVs had, until recently, been divided along clear lines, with LCDs being used for medium and smaller screens, plasma for larger screens, and rear-projection used for the largest sizes. However, advances in LCD technology now allow mass production of screens of up to 40 inches in size.
In addition, with a Sony/Samsung LCD factory coming on line next year, it appears that Sony have decided it is more profitable to produce their own LCD screens rather than obtain plasma screens from other manufacturers.
Sony's main plasma screen factory in Ichinomiya, Aichi Prefecture, Japan, will reduce its production of plasma screens over time, and increase production of LCD and rear-projection screens."
Makes sense! (Score:3, Informative)
/insert flames from irate plasma TV owners below
Re:Will this bring prices down? (Score:5, Informative)
And, you HAVE to get the extended warrenty on a plasma (its stupid not to). The LCD extended warrenty is "optional." Most people don't take that into account. Besides, LCD's have a much longer life expectancy.
Re:And why wouldn't they? (Score:3, Informative)
GO plasma... (Score:4, Informative)
Plasma Myths [engadget.com]
LCD's also have lousy contrast ratios and poor refresh rates compared to Plasma. However, in the market, one technology doesn't automatically trump another. You gotta shop SMART. Currently there are some good LCD screens that outperform some poor Plasma screens. So just buying Plasma doesn't guarantee you a better picture over LCD. It really depends on how much money you're willing to spend.
Eventually LCD's are going to catch up and surpass Plasmas but that's not the case now or in the near future (next year or so).
I myself have a demo Panasonic 42PX20 that has about 6000+ hours on it and I've not noticed any brightness changes at all. My only complaint is that the picture isn't as good as a CRT. But that's true of all flat panels I've observed.
Important shopping tip kids: Contrast is the key, watch dark scenes. Most of the flat panel screens (LCD, Plasma and RPTV LCD screens) will crunch black. So as soon as you get to a dark scene, you don't see shades of gray, everything just goes to black. (Some TVs will auto-adjust their contrast/brightness to counter this but then you end up with brightntess shifts between bright and dark scenes).
Caveat Emptor!
Re:Will this bring prices down? (Score:3, Informative)
But on an LCD you just replace the backlight, no?
Plasma just seems like a dud to anyone educated about it.
Re:Plasma is overrated (Score:4, Informative)
Nice guess. The real killer is the plasma. Plasma is made of excited high speed atoms. (speed equates to heat at these geometries) If only a photon hit the phosphor then things would be fine, but the plasma (hot gas) hits the phosphor and sputters it away (much like a sputter dep tool or etcher in the manufacture of semiconductors). The display is a plasma etcher sputtering away the phosphors that produce the pretty colors.
In newer sets they are trying to reduce this erosion of the phosphors. I'm not sure how they are doing this, but a hot plasma near a soft phosphor still equates to some sputtering.
At least in an LCD TV, the lamp is replaceable for less than $50 in parts. (cold cathode tube) This is not the case in a plasma set.
Re:GO plasma... (Score:3, Informative)
Contrast is a big issue. AFAIK, there isn't an LCD screen that can match the black levels that I get with my plasma (there wasn't in July at least). Yeah, maybe my plasma won't be alive and kicking in 10 years. But I'll enjoy 10 years of dark scenes that are actually black instead of grey.
Re:Kibbles-n-bits (Score:2, Informative)
Sorry, I meant the Sony WEGA 34" [sonystyle.com] model which, as you can see is spec'd at 194lbs unpacked. Packed it is in the 240-250 range. I know this, because a friend, against my counseling, bought one last month.
Re:Will this bring prices down? (Score:3, Informative)
This is inaccurate and misleading from several perspectives.
First of all, plasma brightness loss is related to hours of use, not time in general. That means that whatever dimming you get is proportional to the hours you have the thing on -- so saying "after only two years of use" is a bit bizarre, unless you're talking about leaving the thing on continuously for two years, which would be out of line for most situtations.
Secondly, plasma brightness loss is also related to how bright you have the display turned up; most plasma monitors have a setting for viewing in bright rooms (which is brighter, of course) and another for viewing in dark rooms. Lifetime with the slightly dimmer setting is vastly improved. Ten seconds spent setting this up can vastly increase the lifetime of your plasma monitor.
What you want to look at is the number of viewing hours a particular model is expected to produce, and then convolve that with the number of hours you spend in front of the monitor. If you can do this honestly, you'll end up with a reasonable approximation of the monitor's expected lifetime.
For people who use the monitor to view movies 2-3x a week (as I do), the useful lifetime of a plasma monitor you purchase will most likely be defined by obsolescence, resale, electronic death or your own death, rather than by brightness fade.
For people who want to use an HD plasma screen to watch television for many hours a day... well, at that point, you'd probably be better off with a traditional glass TV anyway. It'll fade too, but at least they're inexpensive. You can get a high def, widescreen glass TV for under a grand right now. You can check here [crutchfield.com] for some examples... there's a 26 inch HD monitor there for $599, for example. Toshiba, Sanyo and Hitachi all have very reasonable models in the 30 or so inch range. Shop around; Crutchfield isn't the only source out there. You can almost certainly do better if you work at it.