Students Tracked By RFID 866
TheMeuge writes "The New York Times is
reporting
a new development in the unrelenting progress of the
RFID juggernaut. The school district
of
Spring, Texas has adopted RFID as a way to track students' arrival and
departure. Upon being scanned, the data are transmitted to both the school
administrators, as well as city police. I guess cutting class is no longer an
option."
barcode (Score:5, Funny)
Re:barcode (Score:5, Funny)
Because the barcode tattoo is _so_ 1984.
Re:barcode (Score:3, Insightful)
Exactly the opposite of individual ID. The Mark of the Beast is the same for everyone, and doesn't identify anyone. Using that system, you could tell that somebody was in the school, but not who, because there no longer *is* any "who".
Re:barcode (Score:5, Interesting)
For clarification of this position see the parallel prophecy given to the prophet Ezekiel at Ezek ch 9, where a 'secretary' from God is seen marking the foreheads of those that would be saved. It is clear that they get their mark because of their inner groaning over the detestible things being done in the Earth -- detestible according to God's standards, not their own. All others, starting from the sanctuary (those saying that they are Godly but are falsely so) are to be destoyed by the six other messengers.
The physically tattooed marks and RFID tags are a means to control others, and of course things like these appeal to the masses because these measures seem benign, even helpful. After all, if you've done nothing wrong, what's to fear? But in the end they are a means of control. Today we have security cameras monitoring everything, even traffic flow, cross-referencing vehicle tags. People are being photographed hundreds of times a day in public places and their faces cross-referenced by high-speed computers, police now dress and train as military combatants. Core Internet routers are now archiving every single packet without prejudice. Voice recognition systems are scanning phone conversations in real-time. Fully automted packet-data-examining systems. And so on...it's all very sad, but it is also a warning.
When Hitler began rouding people up, it all seemed benign and even helpful to the majority. Even those being rounded up believed that they had nothing wrong and thus had nothing to fear, according to their own testimony. But those that would not go along with the round-up got rounded up too. Compare that to the entire context of Rev ch 13. Hitler's actions were a dry run for the larger showdown that is to come, but it will be a world-wide affair according to Revelation. And God steps n to protect his own, and gives them the gift of the new paradise on Earth which he has promised.
But now for the University science: According to Stanley Milgram's famous experiment, most people will go along with those perceived to be in authority, no matter how objectionable the request might seem upon first glance. And the Stanford Prison Experiment shows that most people in charge of others will without fail revel in sadism in very short order when given control over others. So, that people will attack those who desire to serve God en masse -- preventing them from even maintaining livlihoods and even from buying and selling to sustain life -- will be willing participants, even those of you who are convinced right now that you would never had help Hitler. Reliable scientific research consistently shows that most people would have, regardless of what they say when asked hypothetically.
(Okay, mighty moderators, protectors of the /. common good, have your way with me. At least it wasn't posted anonymously. And, furthermore, I've actually read and sudied the Bible -- unlike most who are happy to comment as if they know what it says or mod down those that have the courage to repeat what it says -- hehehe.)
Re:barcode (Score:5, Informative)
The Stanford Prison Experiment [wikipedia.org] has recently gotten a little more press as a result of the problems at Abu Ghraib. Volunteer students at Stanford University were put into one of two roles: guards or prisoners. Despite being smart, "psychologically stable" people, the guards rapidly became abusive and the prisoners had varied reactions, from rebellion to one developing a psychosomatic rash within a day. (Philip Zimbardo ran the study).
Re:barcode (Score:4, Interesting)
Someone who is thoughtful, and willing to explore the ways in which his beliefs mirror the world, and to consider as metaphysical those beliefs that DON'T mirror the world is much more congenial, and, to my mind, a much better kind of person.
That many of which we hear are both biblical scholars and dogmatic fundamentalists should not blind us to the fact that many biblical scholars are intelligent people that would be nice to know. And AREN't dogmatic lunatics.
I, personally, am not a Christian of any denomination, despite having been raised as one. I follow a much less common religion with a gnostic (but non-christian) basis. And I don't have any church. This causes me to be occasionally terrified about the fundamentalist Christians, most of whom don't even realize that they are followers of the cult of Osiris (historically speaking...not denying that there was a Jesus Christ just because I have no evidence indicating that such a person actually existed except in the sense that Nicolas Bourbaki did).
Re:barcode (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes I do, based on the Scientific Method. Most people that understand it recognize that it is still a theory. Proof? Simple: If you yourself contracted a cancer, is it good or is it bad? Cancer, according to evolution, is the engine of progress. Truth is, you'd leave everything just the way it is. Nobody wants their DNA fooled with because they know intuitively that it's a bad thing. Stanley Miller gave up trying to prove his organic soup theory because he could never make it work (one initial success followed by a career of failures) and that he could never eliminate himself from the experiments. Ironically, his experiments were to prove all this could have happened blindly, without intelligent intervention, but he realized after years and years of failures his experiments never worked without his thoughtful intelligence guiding it. So, in pure scientific terminology, evolution is still a theory, since no one has demonstrated exactly how it works and demonstrated it experimentally. And I might also point out that evolution relates to how organisms morph across specie boundaries, not how life appears in the first place. That is the providence of abiogenesis vs. panspermia.
I arrived at creationism using the Sherlock Holmes method: Eliminate the impossible, and whatever's left, however improbable, is the truth. Since evolution is mathematically so remote so as to be impossible I gave up on it. After years of objective and deep academic research that had nothing to do with Bible research. I initially set out to disprove the Bible, but could not unless I abandoned objectivity.
The book The Blind Watchmaker, often cited as having proved evolution, says in one chapter that to transform (evolve) an ordinary squirrel into a flyiong squirrel, one simply needs to find a clumsy squirrel with loose skin and have it fall from trees so often that it soon learns to glide to the ground. Okay, fine. Show me how it's done: get all the regular squirrels you want, and throw them from trees and produce a flying squirrel. If you can, you still haven't proven evolution, because I don't beleive that such an experiment would demonstrate a crossing of specie boundaries. When you've accomplished that feat, you woill have progressed from theory to fact. Otherwise, it's just a theory (hypothesis, actually, since it lacks the detail in the specific mechanisms involved).
As far as the Earth being flat, the Bible pointed out it is a sphere some 3,000 years ago (Isiaih 40:22), some 250 years before Pythagoras. And it never said the Earth is the center of the universe. So, you're just making those things up. And the Bible clearly says that the subconscience is very treacherous and must be carefully monitored and curbed by the conscious mind (James 1:14,15).
As for the final outcome, whether you are correct that the world will continue and man will evolve into some higher species through blind chance, or I am correct in believing the Bible's predictions, only time will tell.
Re:"their" counting on it (Score:3, Insightful)
Cutting Class (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Cutting Class (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Cutting Class (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Cutting Class (Score:3, Funny)
And still some people think that tinfoil hats are of no use.
Tightens his tinfoil hat.
Re:Cutting Class (Score:3, Interesting)
Anyway, subdermal tags are no match for an MRI... :-)
Re:Cutting Class (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Cutting Class (Score:5, Informative)
the Houston, TX educational system was based
upon faked data. Students that did poorly
were moved to another school district, while
the majority of dropouts were never designated
as such. Lies, damn lies, and statistics.
His "success" in Houston was the premise for
Bush's "No Child Left Behind" program, which
has brought little success but much turmoil
to school districts across the nation. This
is largely due to it being a Federal, albeit
woefully underfunded, mandate.
RFID tags, particularly implanted RFID tags,
for students is the wave of the future. And
when many of these students do drop out of
school, they will feel equally at home with a
minimum wage job at their local Wal-Mart, which
eventually will require their employees to be
RFID-tagged, along with their stock of WMD
(Wal-Mart Merchandise Dumping).
In reality, our calenders should be altered
to reflect that "1984" was the start of a new
epoch, rather than just a prescient sci-fi
novel.
And horrified expressions (Score:3, Funny)
As they realise that:
Oops!
Re:Cutting Class (Score:3, Interesting)
The other side is to make the reader part of the equasion too (such as those USB/fingerprint combo drives). This means you keep any latent
Re:Cutting Class (Score:5, Interesting)
My real problem is what will happen when they get lost. My school instituted mandatory photo ID cards this year and pretty much everyday there's a crowd of 20-100+ teenagers outside the main office waiting for temporary IDs. Personally I havn't worn mine in two weeks and no one has noticed, so~
I'm also wondering why it would be nessisary to CC the police on who didn't show up in the morning.
Not to mention the fact that someone could track anyone in the school after they figure out which RFID is theirs. I think that's a much bigger invasion of privacy than having to wear photo IDs. I have no doubt that this will be spreading to other counties and states in the near future so I'm glad I'm graduating next year. Saves me the trouble of explaining why my RFID badge has become a finely ground white powder.
Re:Cutting Class (Score:3, Informative)
Not necessarily true, depending on the quality of the RFID badge and scanners. Have you ever seen those credit card like cards that companies use for secured access? Ever wondered "How they do that?" RFID. While I'm not a big fan of RFID on everything, carrying a badge with such a tag is commonplace for companies with secured areas. Oddly enough, dispite that, there still isn't a way to put a
Re:Cutting Class (Score:4, Insightful)
Kind of interesting, since school security has two main concerns: keeping students where they belong (but with enough flexibility to allow them to leave for doctor's appointments, etc), and keeping out people who don't belong-- the divorced parent who lost custody but is determined to keep their child at any cost, for instance.
Oh well, it's not like minors have rights in the US, so the schools are pretty much free to do what they want in this regard.
Re:Cutting Class (Score:3, Interesting)
Wow....school has sure changed since I went (I'm assuming high school). We had a photo id card, but, didn't have to 'wear' it...and frankly, I don't remember ever having to use it for anything after we got it...maybe to check books out of the library or something.
Do t
Why ? (Score:5, Insightful)
Because the public school system in the United States is a holding pen and work/release program for those not yet legally required to work and pay taxes.
The police need to know when prisoners have escaped, don't they?
Re:Cutting Class (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Cutting Class (Score:4, Insightful)
And I'm not arguing against keeping kids in class during class, I'm arguing against them tracking us via RFIDs and keeping a very tight leash on us. They treat people in High School like they're in Elementary School with the amount of things they entrust to us. A good number of us are able to make our own decisions at this age and we need more flexibility, not less.
Re:Cutting Class (Score:3, Insightful)
Congratulations on making it out of that situation alive. There is no "right" way to grow up, and you did what you have to do. I admire you, if your story is true (I'm sure you understand why I'm adding that clause, this being the internet and all.)
I've known many kids that were in your situation, but not necessarily about sports. They invariably turned to drugs and/or burnt out before they finished their freshman year of college.
You're right about the shootings, too
Insanity (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Insanity (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Interesting)
It is insane to use RFIDs to track runners in a marathon? This has been done for over 10 years. It makes for a greatly reduced error rate for time reporting. It is cheaper than hiring people to sit at the finish line to record times. It allows immediate results tied to a person. If anything is insane, it is a person with an irrational fear of non-contact tags. They have been used for over 20 years in various imp
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Insightful)
And why is there a near-zero rate up to now ?
Because up they were used in such specific situations where usually nobody could have personal gain from misusing them.
Once the technology gets more widespread, people may have valid reasons to crack or misuse the system and will find a way around it.
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Insightful)
The participants in a marathon are all consenting adults. They are able to refuse to participate. The students in a school are children who have no choice about attending.
RFID is different from all previous forms of identification because it's the only one which can be reliably read from a distance without your consent. Remember that the short range of these devices is simply due to the power and sensitivity of the detector. Bluetooth isn't suppos
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Insightful)
Just like I wouldn't consent to my boss installing a tracker for when I arrive at work. Although they already use electronic door keycards to unlock the outside door, usually enough people arrive at the same time that only one or two people get scanned for the large group. And there's always people who forgot their cards and nobody knows.
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Informative)
You have no idea how fucked up your country looks from down under.
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Insightful)
For instance, a couple of years ago [ok so roughly 8 or so] the high school I went to started a "10 missed classes and you're suspended". Did that stop skipping? Did that make the students more respectful of the teachers and their peers [specially in g
Re:Insanity (Score:5, Insightful)
So left to their own devices most children would come around on their own. The ones who don't want to can live exciting lives with a grade 10 education.
But you do realize that, in this wonderful democracy of ours, their vote will count just as much--maybe more if they're in Ohio--as yours, right? Will you be so flippant with regard to their education and "exciting lives" when you have to pay more in taxes to help pay for their welfare check and/or jail term?
My point is, our children, including the "dumb" ones, matter. Our FUTURE matters. Children are affected by not only by what we say but also what we do. If we set forth an example that it's OKAY for the authorities to monitor your every movement for our children now, how much easier do you think it will be able to convince them unwarranted searches are similarly okay in the future?
-Grym
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Interesting)
Ever hear the saying "you can show a horse the water but you can't make him drink?" that's not just clever it's also what the christian right would call "divine". While I'm not a religious type I do swing for "choice".
It's upto the 14 year old kid to *c
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Interesting)
*cough*
I thought "easy tests" were a good thing. on the other hand, that was becasue I thought preparing for tests wa a waste of time. if I can't walk in an do very well, I don't know the material well enough, or the test is badly written.
example: multivariate calculus. 6-problem exams, where each problem was quite trivial if you knew the material and pretty much impossible if you didn't. now that is a good tes
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Insightful)
That's not really a sound argument. The same could be said for anything we do that ends up costing tax payers money. People with bigger cars do more damage to the road. People who eat poorly require more medical attention (more hospitals, more medicare -- and in Canada health care is a direct drain on taxes). Are you saying we should regula
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Interesting)
Its hard to seperate government regulation and a free country.
With less regulation it is more difficult to maintain an orderly society , which consequently puts limits on how much an individual can do because of the massive effort that is needed just to deal with the entropy of daily life.
A heavily regulated society will provide a baseline of order so that citizens can ignore the basics of day to day life, and concentrate on more complex things. But too much regulation makes a very rapid switch from fre
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Insightful)
School childern are already trained not to put up a fuss about school wide locker searches or searching of persons. Now they are being taught that have any concealing containers on you is wrong. How much longer until all school clothing is see through for a security measure?
Re:Insanity (Score:3, Interesting)
Where is this different from taking attendence? This is just an electronic way of doing it. Doing it on the bus is just another cover for the schools in our lawyer/litigation happy society.
As long as these are only on bus
Funny (Score:3, Insightful)
Thank you idiot america.
Re:Funny (Score:3, Interesting)
http://traffic.houstontranstar.org/layers/ [houstontranstar.org]
Tin foil hat (Score:5, Funny)
Mark of the Beast (Score:2, Interesting)
In Australia, they use now swipe cards to check attendance at schools. Swiping at a terminal brings up a mugshot of the student on the screen, so the staff member can perform a visual check to see why Abdul Habib has blue eyes and long blonde hair...
Re:Mark of the Beast (Score:5, Informative)
I wonder if this is coming closer to the Mark of the Beast that the bible talks about?
How can it be? Revaltions it was an apocalyptic writing (one of many) about the state of the Christian church at that time, under threat from both overt source (persecution) and more subtle ones (people lured to other faiths, such as worship of the Roman emporer).
Whatever the Mark of the Beast was supposed to be, it was something that existed then, not now. So it can't be RFID tags. Revelations was never a prophecey or prediction.
A quick Google turned up this [wcg.org] which looks like a good starting point for finding out about apocalyptic writings.
RFID circumvention (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:RFID circumvention (Score:5, Interesting)
And finally, if they eventually decide to implant:
Thos are just the things I thought of in the last two minutes. I could probably think of more more.
allergic reaction (Score:5, Interesting)
You have the poison ivy, you know what to do with the people who don't play along.
Re:allergic reaction (Score:3, Funny)
Hold on, I'll FedEx you a bunch. Along with some toads, rabbits, and cats. If you cannot use the toads, rabbits, and cats...just let them loose in the countryside as I'm sure they'll just go away and die.
Re:allergic reaction (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:allergic reaction (Score:3, Insightful)
Ah the prisoner (Score:5, Funny)
In the School
What do you want?
Information
Whose side are you on?
That would be telling . .
We want Information
You won't get it
By hook or by crook . .
We will
Who are you?
The new Number Two
Who is Number One?
You are Number Six
I am not a number . .
I'm a free man!
(Mocking laughter)
Re:Ah the prisoner (Score:3, Funny)
Freedom to monitor (Score:5, Insightful)
The official USA propaganda is that the rest of the world envy USA because of it's freedom. Well, I don't envy the freedom US authorities has to continously monitoring anyone for no reason at all.
Re:Freedom to monitor (Score:5, Insightful)
The interesting thing is that you're so "free" that this gross invasion of privacy is allowed. While in a "less free" country this would be completely against all laws.
I'm not really trying to judge, but it's not clear which of the systems that is best at protecting individual freedom.
Re:Freedom to monitor (Score:5, Insightful)
That said, this is a really sad indication of the neo-conservative movement sweeping through America (particularly in the southern states such as Texas). This is the next logical step from the same people that brought you teen curfews.. The same people up in arms over the intro. to Monday Night football. The same people who become outraged at this slightest hint of sexuality... in short, in their (well founded IMHO) desire to protect their children and themselves, they've lost all semblance of reason. On the surface making sure kids stay in school and learn gives them the best chance for success as adults.. that's a noble cause. However, they've taken a shotgun approach here. Now they're teaching kids that humiliation and bold invasions of privacy should be expected... This doesn't create a society of good adults, but wildly disenfranchised and angry ones.
Re:Freedom to monitor (Score:3, Insightful)
As far as the PATRIOT act, it's getting dialed back bit by bit, which is how our system here works. Someone does something foolish in the heat of the moment, and cooler heads eventually prevail.
Beating up nerds? (Score:3, Funny)
Social engineering RFID into the children (Score:5, Insightful)
This is totally wrong. You are compelled by law to attend school. Most can't afford to NOT go to government school. Now the government is tagging people like animals.
Be VERY afraid of the first RFID generation, ones who grow up with this commonplace, who never knew an age without it. Who will thing we are a bunch of kooks for opposing it.
That is why those who want to social engineer people ALWAYS want to start with the schools...
Re:Social engineering RFID into the children (Score:5, Insightful)
That is why those who want to social engineer people ALWAYS want to start with the schools...
I've always wondered how we can expect our kids to fight for liberty later when we gave them none.
How can you miss something you never had?
Re:Social engineering RFID into the children (Score:4, Insightful)
If you mean "fight" in the sense of soldiering, don't worry that's the easy part. The mental conditioning that is employed in the military (any military) is designed to enhance the bonds that men (mostly men, though women take to it, the bonds are different, as they provoke more of a defensive than offensive FoF reflex) form in small social groups. The end result is that to a soldier "freedom" is like a team name. You might as well say "Red Sox". If you think that can't be the case because soldiers are willing to die "for freedom", think about what would happen if you killed a member of a baseball team. The other players would be willing to kill and/or die to either prevent or avenge that killing, even though they probably never knew each other before joining the team. Such is the power of the team instinct in humans.
So, you could call an opressive dictatorship "freedom", just as long as your soldiers are indoctrinated to defend it.
The real question is a much more frightening one: how can we expect our kids to defend freedom as our future leaders when we didn't given them any as children? To what depths will our future judges, congresspersons and presidents sink when they have been treated like this growing up?
That one keeps me up at night.
Maybe this is a case (Score:5, Interesting)
Wonder why (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Wonder why (Score:3, Insightful)
Am I the only one who thinks that the solution to this is not more invasions of privacy (via tags), but less legal bullshit (via less lawyers, more personal responsibility, and less stupid laws)?
This is the wrong approach. (Score:3, Insightful)
Children of the free world (Score:3, Insightful)
Ferris Bueller (Score:5, Interesting)
Students are *not* cattle (Score:5, Insightful)
- a few schools have begun monitoring student arrivals and departures using technology similar to that used to track livestock and pallets of retail shipments.
And adults wonder why our kids aren't learning important ideas like responsibility...The Slippery Slope.. (Score:5, Insightful)
Seriously, most proponents of RFID technology site its benefits in stock and supply line management only, and keep assurring us that RFID tags embedded in products will never be used to track people.
And yet we're now seeing instances of the middleman, i.e the product tag, being bypassed altogether and people being tagged outright. Is this really what RFID was developed for in the first place? Tracking people?
OK, these people are children. But that doesn't make this any less wrong. First criminals, then kids. They'll start on employees next, move it up to registered drivers, you'll see.
Of course tagging children has nothing to do with their safety. Anyone who says so is a liar or an idiot. As has been mentioned numerous times, the legions of pedophiles that lurk outside scholl gates every day will simply take off the tag, as will the kids when they want to leave for that matter. Of course the response from RFIDphiles is "Let's implant the tag subdermally!!!! FOREVER!!!! What a great(completeely consistent with a free society) idea!!!". *Sigh*. Why can't so many people think past their next meal?
The purpose of RFID tracking people is to cause a chilling effect. This is denied in the case of children and the public, but is the primary reason given for tagging criminals. Bit of a contridiction there. Effectively tagging children is a form of control, and an extreamly invasive one at that. I don't care what age I am, or who you are. No-one should know and have a documented record of my exact movements. Period. You want to protect your kids? Sit down and talk with them once in a while. Find out where they go rather than right clicking on a toolbar icon to see where they are. Don't squash their, or my, freedoms just because your too busy watching fear factor to look after your own kids.
And of course when I start using by blocker tag, I'll be accused of aiding pedophiles and endangering the children. Won't someone please think of the children!!? I am!
I'm ready for people to start with the tinfoil hat cracks, but to them I say, this is the exact kind of thing you said would never happen!! Well it's happening right now! What are you going to do about it.
RFID tracking is data rape.
Re:The Slippery Slope.. (Score:5, Interesting)
And yet we're now seeing instances of the middleman, i.e the product tag, being bypassed altogether and people being tagged outright. Is this really what RFID was developed for in the first place? Tracking people?
Hhhhmmmmmm, odd that - that there's a product that most people think would be really useful for this one particular (benign) use, but that a minority want to use for bad things. Can't see how that could ever happen with any other technology.
You're right, this is wrong, and no I would not submit my daughter to this sort of treatment (and yes, I do actually have a daughter). But you seem to be implying that
a) this was an inevitable (ab)use of RFID technology
b) this one dubious use should see the tech banned/shunned despite all other legitimate uses
As with all things, don't blame the technology itself for the use to which some people put it. Do that, and you'll end up banning all tech, including sharp sticks and fire.
RFID tracking is data rape.
That makes you sound like an extremist; I'd suggest that if you're serious about fighting things like this that you avoid such emotive language. You'll piss off more people than you sway with it.
Re:The Slippery Slope.. (Score:3, Insightful)
I swear there's a Stupid Gene that gets turned on when people have kids, that makes them forget how much it sucked to be a kid -- to have NO privacy, to have NOTHING of your own, the sense of being OWNED by your parents, the sense that NO ONE TRUSTS YOU, and that YOU DON'T MATTER.
The most important thing you
Just Imagine (Score:4, Insightful)
Needless to say, not many people were really turned on to learn. Because nothing of substance was being taught.
Personally, I think that large school reforms are in order. Let's divide students into classes with the type of instruction that suits them best. Let's not teach college prep to everyone, they'll resent it. Few people really connect with the idea of liberal arts anyway (even in college, I was a bit surprised) and it forms the basis for most highschool course requirements. Articles I've seen recently say that boys are doing poorly in American schools. It looks like all girls schools in England do significantly better than comparable coed schools, especially in math and science. Maybe gender segregation would help. Girls seem to be intimidated by boys in these subjects, and boys need more structure and encouragement. There's a lack of adolescent-to-adult ritual in our country. Maybe this could help provide what truant students are missing.
It would be preferable to humiliation like this RFID crap.
Re:Just Imagine (Score:4, Interesting)
Turns out the girls do far better in single-sex class rooms.
But boys do better in mixed set class room!
Quite how you solve that, I don't know.
Re:Just Imagine (Score:5, Informative)
Ok, let's hear some ideas. I'm a teacher, so I'll be ecstatic to get some help in this area. Before you begin though, understand that we're state mandated to provide instruction on specific topics in a specific timeframe. We also have to make sure that no one is left out of activities, or if they are, develop an alernative activity. We also have to make sure that Susie who takes one day to learn plate tectonics doesn't get too far ahead of Johnny who takes 4 days. We also...
I hope you see the point. School simply isn't fun most of the time. No matter how you slice it, some things are boring to teach and boring to learn. Couple this with restrictions on teaching techniques, budget problems, and over protective parents, and I'm amazed anything get's taught.
Re:Just Imagine (Score:4, Insightful)
This bizarre belief that every student should advance in their knowledge at exactly the same rate is the primary reason I hated all of my schooling until I got to college. Why shouldn't Susie get too far ahead of Johnny? Why shouldn't she be able to spend those three extra days learning the subject in more depth, or painting, or playing in the sandbox?
From the beginning of elementary school to the end of high school, I suffered from this. I pick things up quickly and don't need a lot of repetition. As a result, I was forced to do a great deal of homework that I didn't need, attend classes that weren't interesting, and I generally hated the experience. (Not everything was this way, but close.) Once I got to college, where homework is more of a check than a forced study aid, where classes are dense, and where people are expected to do more on their own if they need practice, things got a lot better.
I realize the situation is different at the lower levels, and I don't have a proposed solution, but I still believe that this idea that all children must learn at approximately the same rate, and they must stay in a group of other children with exactly the same age, is one of the more poisonous ones in our educational system.
Re:Just Imagine (Score:3, Interesting)
I know it's a lot of text and all, but read the comment.
Personally, I got a lot out of our 'state-mandated' curriculum... but then, I had good teachers, which can make up for a lot.
By the way, we had something similar to what you described in our school district. It worked very poorly, because most students aren't adequately self-motivated to learn. Except, as it turned out,
Required implants (Score:5, Insightful)
The Police? (Score:5, Funny)
000 - Nothing to see here.
001 - normal kid with mischevious mind. Watch for changes. May be intimidated back to 000 with minor police brutality.
010 - Thief. Arrest if lingering in the parking lot or around school supply cabinets.
011 - Fighter. Arrest if having an animated discussion with any 000's they don't normally congregate with or other 011's.
100 - Stabby. Arrest when outer perimiter metal detectors are set off. Notify cafeteria to dispense plastic silverware to the 100 and immediately surrounding 000's. Exhibits 011 behavior, follow guidelines accordingly.
101 - Brandisher. Arrest when outer perimiter detectors are set off and body mass = yesterday's + #g of any known gun + various # of bullets/magazines.Exhibits 011 behavior, follow guidelines accordingly.
110 - Shooter. Arrest immediately. If no gun is found, plant one or make an announcement that arresting them was the right thing to do.
111 - Dealer. "Accidently" shut fire doors on 111's crushing them to death. Accompany disposed of body with a 110, some stray bullets, and drug paraphenalia.
Yeah, they definately need more Evil Bits...
excelent alibi (Score:4, Insightful)
2- leave the RFID tag there (or wrap tinfoil in your arm if is subdermal)
3- leave the school
4- comit a crime
5- ???
6- profit
#5 could prety much be "don't worry with police. they think you were in school".
thei're just giving students an excelent, state sanctioned alibi.
i watched a movie once about a gang that used british prision system as alibi. they all comited light crimes (no more than 6 months jail time), then they broke of the jail, stole a roll of paper from the comapny that prints brit money, printed a batch of bills, hide the money, returned to jail.
when the police found about the stolen paper, they dismissed the gang as suspects because they were all in jail, end were still there.
do i see something like this happening in texas ?
Re:excelent alibi (Score:3, Funny)
do i see george clooney coming to michgan to steal my girlfriend?! i think so! that is why i'm covering my apartment i
The Creationist State (Score:4, Insightful)
Now we have soccermoms micromanaging their own children's every movement with an eye in the sky.
Welcome to George Bush's America.
Re:The Creationist State (Score:3, Insightful)
We can never prove that man evolved from apes. We can find evidence to suggest that it's highly likely that it happened, but that's as far as we can go.
Well, if you invent time travel and set out to document you entirely ancestry all the way back to an ape, you could prove it, but I wouldn't bet on the odds of that happening.
So yes, evolution is an unproven theory. It just happens to best one that we have at the moment.
A Texas Highschool Student (Score:4, Insightful)
This is just a slight example of how ill-directed our administrator's are. They are easily blinded by people who have even the slightest ability to market a service or product, and I would not be in the least surprised to see that my class mates are all tagged with RFID in some form or fashion at the start of the next school year.
homeschool (Score:3, Insightful)
And make sure your state doesn't mess with the homeschool law(s).
It's not like there's really any educational excellence to be missed there (the fallacy of the false alternative). Public schools don't have the power to protect your kids, and as this story illustrates, you wouldn't want them to have the kind of power that they would need anyway.
Priorities? (Score:5, Insightful)
When the district unanimously approved the $180,000 system, neither teachers nor parents objected ... Rather, parents appear to be applauding. "I'm sure we're being overprotective, but you hear about all this violence," said Elisa Temple-Harvey, 34, the parent of a fourth grader. "I'm not saying this will curtail it, or stop it, but at least I know she made it to campus."
"We've been fortunate; we haven't had a kidnapping," Mr. Weisinger said. "But if it works one time finding a student who has been kidnapped, then the system has paid for itself."
So, let me see if I get this right -- crime rates have been going down for years and are at historical lows, but people are worried more than ever about crimes they "hear about."
Without investigating, I'd wager that the odds of being kidnapped are much lower than than those of being struck by lightning, lower still than being run over by a car at a crosswalk, and lower still that little Johnny or Susie will drop out of school altogether.
Maybe the money would be better spent on textbooks? Or teachers? Nah ... let's spend money to fix a problem we don't really have so that we can satisfy the need to believe we're doing something. For the children's sake, of course.
Zero sum situation (Score:5, Insightful)
I am a teacher, parent & employers of 16-23 year olds. We've set the education system up for failure, and it will continue to fail at amazing rate as desperate "solutions" such as this are thrown at the system until it kills a substantial percentage of the nation's youth.
first and foremost- I'm going to say I blame the parents. (woohoo! watch that karma drop!) none of this would be necessary if the children were taught, or had it modeled for them, or had the values embedded in them that education was of value. That and the parents are going to have to suck it up and be the bad guy, be the hardass, be the one make certain the child is held accountable for their actions.
A large part of the problem is that the system relieves parents of their duties of parenting. And then in turn holds schools responsible, and then in turn holds teachers responsible.
But guess what, with all the responsibilities and duties and irrelevant tasks that have been placed on teachers- they have no time to teach. In fact, persons with any passion or desire to pass on knowledge and skills in a field are quickly driven out because they don't spend enough time doing attendance in the correct manner, because they don't spend enough time preparing children for a standardized test, because they don't document a complete and unique separate lesson plan/learning system FOR EACH CHILD.
Which, if we allowed those children to who really wanted to learn, to be in the classes of those who really wanted to teach... (in my opinion) making individual plans wouldn't be so bad because you're not trying to force material down the throat of a child who simply doesn't care. As teachers we can't make them care, and yet parents and then administrators, and even future employers, are blaming us for students coming out without a work ethic, without a sense of responsibility, pride in their work, or the common sense to believe that they should show up on time, or do the task they were given through to completion.
how's this relevant to the RFID tags? I used to live in Spring and taught in the district next to it. They're actually a pretty "calm" district comparatively. Not way out on the forefront of education, not in the ghettos. Just another suburban district on the outskirts of a large city. (I've heard rumor that even people in NY and LA recognize Houston as a "large city"). They have the luxury if you will, to try to throw new technology at old problems. they have some cash apparently, they're not having to spend it on metal detectors for every door, but tardiness and skipping? the tags them selves i would imagine are relatively cheap, and the scanners not too bad compared to some of the other ludicrous expenditures I've seen (and while teacher salaries fall in that category, its on the lower end of the spectrum).
I can see how easily this could be sold to a school board, teachers and administrators. School board finally has some means of knowing where every child is. Administrators don't have to spend a fraction of their existing resources to implement or monitor this new system, and if done right, teachers are no longer responsible for the tedious tasks of attendance. (which in and of itself wouldn't be a problem if you didn't have 35 kids all coming in tardy-with various levels/legitimacies of excuses). Only the poor tech resource folks are contemplating suicide.
But as another poster pointed out.. it does nothing for the kids except for give them something else to hate and manipulate. It doesn't hold them responsible for anything.
It doesn't actually DO anything.
It would be great fun to try a D-DOS attack. (Score:4, Funny)
Someone should introduce... (Score:3, Interesting)
No more "Family Movies Act of 2004" banning skipping of commercials. No more COPPA Act, keeping kids off the Internet. etc.
Students NEED to be able to skip class (Score:5, Insightful)
However, nothing gets seriously broken by kids skipping classes very occasionally. How square are the kids supposed to be?
Kids that are allowed a certain freedom and have some possibility of opposing authority grow up far more interesting.
Just think how interesting you find a person who has never skipped class, never talked back at their parents etc.
The truth is, the parental generation have always tried to impose severe restrictions on the younger generation, and the younger generation have always broken them. This is the way of life. The moment we make it impossible for kids to break their parents rules, we have changed the game in a way I don`t think we see the consequences of.
It is ironic that we impose millions of laws and regulations, but the majority actually disrespects people that always live by them.
There are certain things every (semi) interesting person have done. If you have never done any of the following you need to get out more:
1. Skip class
2. Go above the speed limit
3. Take a u-turn where it wasn't allowed, but noone was around.
4. Drink or smoke without being allowed to do so
5. Sneak in somewhere you don't belong.
I will put up rules for my children and I will be fairly strict about some of them. But if my children never breaks my rules I would be suspicious that they are hiding something major, or disappointed that my kids grew up to be that square.
A well balanced human being bends or breaks rules now and then, but know which rules they really should abide by. The important lesson is to teach the children which rules are absolute, and which can be bent a little.
I have no problem with this (Score:5, Funny)
Don't tag everyone (Score:3, Insightful)
Likewise, I'd love to see convicted criminals tagged in someway. Wouldn't it be nice if store owners could identify convicted shoplifters when they enter the store? Sell a consumer scanner that will tell you if a convicted murderer or rapist is nearby when you go for your jog. Or if they are on your property! If your car alarm could sound when a car thief tag is nearby for too long.
I know, there is too much potential for abuse. A man can dream though. And it would sure beat "that guy looks shady" as a method of identifying potential criminals
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Yeah -- and do the same thing when they come for the Jews, right?
Fuckwit.
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:3)
These are the best people to run a school, next to the children themselves. They obviously remember what it felt like being a child with no rights and no power in an educational system that treats them like a cog in a giant conformity machine. When people have kids, they get a little irrational.Why do you think so many bad laws are passe
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:5, Insightful)
Blacks don't have rights, that's why we don't let them vote
Women don't have rights, that's why we don't let them vote.
Of course children have rights. Rights are not granted by the state, but innate. Nothing really dramatic happens to a person on their 18th birthday suddenly endowing them with rights. They've had them all along, it's just the state finally recognizes them. It seriously troubles me that people like you, who apparently find children morally equivalent to livestock are responsible for their education.
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:5, Insightful)
Let me guess, if we don't that would make us unpatriotic as well???
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:4, Interesting)
I think it's important to recognize that students (children, minors) are being entrusted to the public school system to make sure that while under their care, nothing bad happens to any student. They are, in essence, the largest daycare provider in any given area and they have a huge responsibility in keeping tracking and accounting of other people's children.
Now I can't say that it's a good thing that the information is fed to the local law enforcement agency unless there is a particular student they wish to keep track of and in that event, there should be some sort of formality associated with "I need to know when 'Johnny' came and went for the past two weeks and for the next two weeks from now." But to have that information fed to them on a regular basis feels kinda wrong.
But one thing to keep in mind -- while a person is a minor, there are no rights to privacy to speak of. The "rights" they might enjoy are whatever has been granted by their parents and/or the school system. I liken this to the same problem that students have with their "freedom of the press" rights in school newspapers -- while it's all well and good to want to exercise those rights, the fact remains that a school newspaper is a SCHOOL newspaper and as such is actually under the control and supervision of the school system, so guess who is in control of "freedom of the press" in that little world? Absolutely.
It just might be a good thing... I'd be interested to see what pitfalls are to be revealed by any of this.
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:3)
Four hours later, the police knock on your door, saying they were called to the mall where your child was caught shoplifting on CCTV.
Are you going to blame the school for not ensuring that your child was under their supervision? I can probably guarentee that you'll say you won't, but the vast majority of parents will.
Re:Sorry, this is good.... (Score:3, Insightful)
probably another reason why this could be a good thing. The danger here comes when governments try to extend this and that's where this is the thin end of the wedge. It may be a good thing but we'd be stupid to ignore the dangers it also brings.
private schools (Score:3, Informative)
The RFID is probably one of the more minor problems the students at many of our public schools face.