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Communications Handhelds Wireless Networking Hardware

WAP is Dead, Long Live WAP 230

antimatt writes "Everyone knows WAP is dead. It was dead on arrival. Right? Wrong. WAP use, at least in the UK, is up 42% in the last year. Are we seeing postmortem twitching, or a phoenix rising from the wireless ashes?" While the first incarnation was pretty rough, WAP is slowly growing into what people had hoped the first version would be. Now if only it just lost the stigma attached to it.
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WAP is Dead, Long Live WAP

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  • WAP 1 vs. 2 (Score:5, Interesting)

    by SIGALRM ( 784769 ) * on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @04:57PM (#9942882) Journal
    WAP has such a negative stigma attached to it because that's what carriers marketed several years ago
    The stigma is largely a result of the lack of support for WAP 2. Many new phones on the market today support only WAP 1, as well as most of the existing phones already in use.

    WAP 1 had some limitations and faults, but much of that has been addressed in WAP 2. However WAP 2 is only supported by newer, higher end phones.
  • WAP in the UK (Score:2, Interesting)

    by AveBelial ( 762816 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:01PM (#9942910) Journal
    I live in the UK and now after more and more mobile phone offer services such as Colour backrounds, Java Gaming, Ringtones ETC, many websites have started up to give theese for free through wap, which was the main useage between myself and friends, also things such as Vodaphones "Live" service helps, giving a user friendly portal to services that are actully USEFUL, things like train and bus times etc, and because this is set up through the provider, you are linked striaght into the information service. GPRS also will have played a factor in this as there is no more dialing up, or costs per min. Christ even my mother looks up bus/train times on her mobile, and downloads dodgy ringtones!
  • Slashdot wap page? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Hobbex ( 41473 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:03PM (#9942929)
    Speaking of which, when will we see WML version of Slashdot? Currently I use http://slashdot.org/palm [slashdot.org] as the homepage in my cellphone, which works fine, but a true WAP page would be better.

    As the (on topic) side note there is no reason for WAP to die, as it actually is pretty useful. Not only for gratuities checking slashdot and news on the cellphone, but for truly useful things. The public transport system here has a WAP page for checking timetables, which is pretty useful if you don't want to walk from the bar to the busstop only to find you have a halfhour's wait.

    Several TV channels here also put out all there tele-text material on wap, which is nice because it is brief, up to date, and meant to read on a low res screen. The only thing wrong with WAP is the silly price for wireless data (2 Euro per meg!)
  • Few problems (Score:4, Interesting)

    by usefool ( 798755 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:06PM (#9942950) Homepage
    There are few problems with WAP usages, at least from my personal point of view.

    First is the cost, it's not that cheap to use it yet as most service providers are charging by the seconds or bytes.

    Secondly, some phone designs are not good enough to use WAP comfortably, but I am sure this will change with more all-you-can-eat phones coming out.

    On top of that, there isn't enough incentive for site owners to provide a WAP friendly interface, because there isn't much to make out of it.

    Maybe if phone service providers start offering 'referral incentive' to sites, that is, to pay site owners $0.001 per visit via mobile phone, we might be seeing something very quickly.

    Personally I believe providers make more than enough to pay that incentive, and with more sites becoming WAP friendly, more users will start using WAP, and the more the providers will make, and the more they can afford to pay site owners or lower the WAP access cost.
  • by dyefade ( 735994 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:13PM (#9942987) Homepage Journal
    is that vendors are only just starting to really make the effort with their portal services. For example, I (in the UK), am on Orange, it's only recently that the majority of people have had WAP compatible phones, so it's only recently Orange have really made the effort to provide a decent WAP service. Add to this the slow (but now nearly there) uptake of GPRS, and it's not surprising it's taken until now for WAP to become popular. I've only just started to use it myself.

    Another reason it's use is picking up (I would think...) is that you can buy java games, ringtones, graphics etc from your provider via WAP, which is now a big business.
  • by avij ( 105924 ) * on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:17PM (#9943009) Homepage
    We [eurobilltracker.com] use WAP [eurobilltrackerforum.com] for tracking Euro banknotes while travelling. Most of the notes are entered via the web form, but when you're travelling you may not have an internet connection available all the time and that's where WAP comes handy. I just spent a weekend in Brussels in our annual EuroBillTracker meeting, my life would have been miserable if I didn't have my phone with me ;) Unfortunately there are some bugs and limitations in phones that need to be worked around somehow.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:21PM (#9943033)
    why does every single post [slashdot.org] of yours on slashdot mention your shitty pump and dump stock scam [groupshares.com] ?

    why are you really here on slashdot ? perhaps you would do better if you concentrated on your portfolio's selection rather than spam people with pump and dump [groupshares.com] scams , maybe the authorities should take a closer look at you

  • by Alan Cox ( 27532 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:34PM (#9943110) Homepage
    All you need is a dialin modem (eg an old pay as you go mobile 8)) and a Linux box running kannel - now your normal call rate/sminutes apply. GPRS also helps a lot since its then traffic by usage. Certainly thats the big reason I now use the mobile phone stuff a lot more.

    GPRS is actually a lot better for things like irc, which being such low traffic volumes means you can irc on long train journeys with your phone plugged into the sockets virgin trains now supply, and at a low typical cost.

    WAP seems to be on the increase. I've had more mails in the past 3 months about the wapirc gateway I wrote for my old 7110 than in the 2 years before.
  • Re:wap.slashdot.org? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Soruk ( 225361 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @05:35PM (#9943116) Homepage
    It doesn't help that the only consumer-level 3G service in the UK, Three [three.co.uk], only offer a walled garden of content, and don't even permit data calls. No data calls? Even my old Cellnet PAYG SIM allowed me to do that (at a price).
  • by tubabeat ( 605286 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @06:03PM (#9943312)
    Useful, but shouldn't the link be http://www.google.com/wml ??

    It might just be that google sends the html page to me because my blackberry does support html too, maybe wap.google.com works okay for others with wml only phones?
  • by Hobbex ( 41473 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @07:21PM (#9943678)
    My understanding is that megabyte prices will never fall much lower than that. The reason is that the providers are scared of people using VOIP to call cheaper.

    One can get a good VOIP call at 2 kB/s, which is 120 kB/minute. So if they went lower than 0.01 NOK per kB, it would suddenly be cheaper to call with voip over GPRS then making phonecalls with most plans.
  • by powdered toast dude ( 800543 ) * on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @07:29PM (#9943763) Journal
    It doesn't suck, and I typically read /. more from my treo 600 than I do from firefox. But it does need a little help.

    Here's my wishlist for what /. needs to improve in its "lite"/wap/palm version:

    1. Let me log in for crying out loud. I'm a paid subscriber dammit! Plus, slashdot activity contributes to mod points, and my wireless activity goes completely unrecognized. Give me credit for credit due.

    2. I love the "top 5" comments, and sometimes that's all I want to see. But please, do let me see all comments if I want to. Sometimes one of the "top 5" comments will generate lots of good discussion in reply that I then miss.

    3. Let me post. We all know you can't get "first post" if you have to wait until you can get to a "real" screen. Just today I was bitten by this big time -- by the time I got back to my desk to say "hey, why not display pr0n on a girl's boobs", the joke was already old.

    4. Dunno if this happens on wap phones, but at least on my treo 600, the last character in a post or on a page is often dropped. Makes links broken, and often removes the final punctuation character from a poster's comment. It's probably also related that <blockquote> sections and other formatting doesn't carry over to "next page".

    All of that said, I wish every site had a lite/wap version that was even as broken as slashdot's. It's very quick and handy. Viewing normal HTML pages sucks over GPRS. Even a less-than-optimal lite interface is MUCH better than none at all for information browsing.

    Slashdot can do better here, but it is still a leader.

    $0.02,
    ptd

  • Re:WAP 1 vs. 2 (Score:2, Interesting)

    by slyxter ( 609602 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @07:32PM (#9943790) Homepage
    Funny that comes up. I actually did that same thing a week ago with my SE T310. I smashed it against the coffee table though, not the wall. I put it back together but it wasn't working. My provider gave me a nice new phone to replace my "malfuntioning" unit without question. Just 3 weeks away from the warranty expiring too. WAP on my old phone never worked and I had to recreate the WAP settings almost every time I wanted to use it. My new phone doesn't seem to have any problems yet. Now I just need to find something useful to do with WAP until (if) hockey season starts.
  • Re:And stay dead! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by gl4ss ( 559668 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @07:58PM (#9944002) Homepage Journal
    well, sites with special for small screen versions of them have already started to appear in large numbers, it's a good way for a site to get returning visitors, to offer them something they can read daily in a bus or train(returning visitors, isn't that what every news site drools after anyways?).

    most sites with actual content work usually pretty well in opera for series60 for example(hell, even pr0n tgp sites are mostly navigationable). if the content has to be wrapped up in neato flash then there weren't that much content usually to begin with(besides videoclips or games that you wouldnt be playing/downloading on that mobile anyways).. so you can't browse sites that would be useless for you anyways with a mobile which isn't that much of a problem actually.

    and if a site owner bothers he can check the browser tags and return a stripped down version for mobiles without too much hassle.

    of course now with rss feeds being all around you could just use blogines or whatever to read just them nicely.
  • New Technologies (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mobileTen ( 750885 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @08:06PM (#9944062)
    There are new technologies like on2go [on2go.com] which allow live streaming data to the phone. They are like Telletext, but for the phone. It allows you in real-time to see if traffic on a road is getting worse or better. Or if your stocks are going up :) or down :( It is kind of like a combination between WAP and SMS. According to thier web site it was started by a bunch of guys that got frustrated with the cost of SMS and limited appeal of WAP On2go are meant to be in to be in beta testing at the moment and if people want to try out the service they can sign up on the on2go web page.
  • Re:One more user .. (Score:2, Interesting)

    by hitmark ( 640295 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @08:36PM (#9944238) Journal
    there is allso the fact that wap is the perfect media to offer backgrounds, animations for mms phones, ringtones and all that other stuff you want to sell. just find what you want, hit a link and it will be on your phone in seconds and the cost will be put on your next phone bill...
  • Wrong-o (Score:3, Interesting)

    by hqm ( 49964 ) on Wednesday August 11, 2004 @09:02PM (#9944410)
    If you ever tried using WAP and then have tried using iMode's CHTML, you would see why WAP is a steaming pile of doo doo.

    CHTML is a nice clean subset of HTML (think HTML 2.0) which supports all the stuff you're used to, forms, gifs, etc.

    WAP, on the other hand, has a broken idea about "decks" of cards, which they thought would be needed for 400 baud connections or whatever it was designed for.

    Writing WAP applications is irritating, because they don't work. The gateway you're using has the wrong max packet size, or the phone you're using doesn't support the image format, or ... the chances of your app working on someone's phone is close to zero.

    iMode, on the other hand, works on all iMode phones, they have fanatical quality control and DoCoMo calls the compatibility shots.

    Calling WAP a success but the implentation a failure is like calling Communism a success in theory, but it just had a poor implementation.

  • Re:One more user .. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by csteinle ( 68146 ) on Thursday August 12, 2004 @05:24AM (#9945793) Homepage
    It's got less to do with the size of the sceens and more to do with bandwidth. GPRS in real use is still pretty slow, which means lots of big images = bad. Especially as higher broadband penetration means that the "regular internet" gets more and more bandwith intensive.

    I use WAP quite a bit. What for? Train times (including how late the train is), cinema times and football scores. None of which really need lots of images. It's cheaper and quicker than getting any of that information over the phone (as in voice).

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