History of the Automatic Teller

XopherMV writes "The line was long and slow, and he became increasingly irritated as his lunch hour dribbled away. All at once, he had a flash of inspiration. 'Golly, all the teller does is cash checks, take deposits, answer questions like "What's my balance?" and transfer money between accounts,' recalls Wetzel, now 75 and still living in Dallas with his wife. 'Wow, I think we could build a machine that could do that!' And with a $4 million go-ahead from Docutel's parent company, that's exactly what he and his engineers did. Read more about the story of the ATM."

But...

[Zog The Undeniable]

The halcyon period of the ATM could be over, at least in the UK, as the number of machines that charge up to 1.75UKP for a 10UKP withdrawal continues to increase. Some of the big banks are selling off their networks to the fee-charging operators, although it's possible to make very good money from an ATM network on interchange fees alone.

A tip for /. readers driving in the UK: only stop at Moto service stations when using the motorway network. They use free ATMs; most of the others have signed up with the fee-charging vampires.

Re:other denoms

[solive1]

Many of the ATMs I go to now let you get money in $10 increments. Perhaps it's a security reason that they don't have smaller denominatons, or maybe they'd just need a bigger machine (that wouldn't fit in a standard ATM "hole in the wall" for lack of a better term). Actually, they might be available, but banks don't want to switch out all those expensive machines when they're working just fine.

In a perfect world, the ATM would give you any amount of cash you asked for (provided it was in your account), and it would also ask you in what monetary denominations you would like your cash in. Would you like your $25 in all $5s, or would you like two $10s and a $5, or a $20 and a $5?

Re:A great, but ultimately dated, revolution

[Pope]

That's ridiculous. When you go to type in your PIN it says the amount owing right there. If there's an error, it can be corrected before the transaction goes anywhere near you money.

Me, I miss the old IBM ATMs with the glowing red thin slit readout and small card balance receipts, they fit so perfectly in the same space that a bank card fits. None of this bollocks on screen pretty graphics, just a bank of different coloured buttons (one for withdrawal actions, one for deposits) and a sensible layout.

Granted, the new video screen ones are much more flexible when it comes to multiple languages, but those IBM ones were pretty cool.

Re:Text here

[Sukh]

In the UK, ATMs that are part of the Link network are generally free to all participating banks. So, even though I'm a HSBC user, I can use HSBC, Natwest, Lloyds TSB, Halifax etc. ATMs for free. The only time you ever really need to pay to use ATMs is for the private ones in clubs and bars and for building societies.

This close to disaster...

[david.given]

My uncle was the manager responsible for the group at Barclay's Bank that introduced the first ATMs into the UK. He used to tell stories about having to juggle all the various political camps involved.

One of them involved the two rival implementations, both with fairly large followings of engineers: there first one involved the card contained a unique ID that was keyed to a central database, requiring every ATM to be connected to the database in order to authorise connections. This is the one we use today.

The second one involved having all the necessary information, such as the account balance, stored directly on the card. This meant that an ATM could authorise a transaction instantly without needing to communicate with the base. This was popular because it was faster, cheaper, much simpler, and allowed all kinds of nice features like mobile ATMs.

Apparently there were quite a lot of engineers and other managers who didn't understand why having all this information on the card was a bad idea...

So, if you ever use an ATM in the UK, remember my Uncle Ron, who managed to persuade the people in charge that the more expensive, more complex system was in fact the right way to go!

Re:Ya think?

[Dr. Evil]

Wow... I think it has been a little more extreme in Canada.

I have to take time off work to be able to visit a bank and see a real person.

I tried to make a joke once that my bank was open 24 hours... a week. When I realized they were only open 16.

Old teller queues have been ripped out and replaced with cubicle office space for loan officers. It's not uncommon now to see one teller in a bank working half-days and a "business wicket" the other half day.

Banks in Canada lend money out on leverage. The government only requires a very small percentage of actual money in the bank at any given time. The bank literally has the power to generate money from nothing, charge interest for it, and pay it back to the void when done.

Worse, ATMs in popular locations in Canada have been replaced with "White label ATMs"... you know how they said "banks don't charge their own customers to use a machine?" well... the banks realized that they could charge their own customers if they opened a daughter corporation to create ATM machines under a different brand and name, then charge "convenience fees" depending on the location of the ATM.

With all the service charges, I pay:

• $1 for each withdrawal past 2 per month
• $1.50 for interbranch banking (half goes to my bank, half to the other bank)
• $1-$3.50 "convenience" fee.

That can be as high as $3.50 to $5.50 per transaction! I've been stuffing a lot more cash in my drawers at home these days (fewer transactions) and trying to buy everything I can on a credit card. For some dumb reason, credit cards are still "free" for personal use, although the banks were recently thwarted by the government for trying to charge per use... and the banks bleed the retailers dry when you use credit cards.

But the Canadian banking industry is very different than the U.S. As I understand it, the U.S. has a fairly deregulated banking industry. I'm certian that the Canadian banks collude on service charges to deter their customers from leaving.

Re:A great, but ultimately dated, revolution

[GTRacer]

What I don't get, though, is if you're a huge fan of debit cards, why wouldn't you just use a credit card?

For me, one reason - discipline. Or lack thereof. With a debit card, I can't overspend, and the bill is taken care of instantly. On credit, I could see making a slightly overbudget purchase, promising myself I'll make up for it, and then not. And then getting hit with interest.

Also, I don't like signing things. I'd rather hit 5 buttons in a half-sec than fiddle with those electronic pens and tiny writing windows...

GTRacer
- No, it's not 1-2-3-4-5.

Re:Ya think?

[GNU(slash)Nickname]

Worse, ATMs in popular locations in Canada have been replaced with "White label ATMs"... you know how they said "banks don't charge their own customers to use a machine?" well... the banks realized that they could charge their own customers if they opened a daughter corporation to create ATM machines under a different brand and name, then charge "convenience fees" depending on the location of the ATM.

Actually, the driver here is the location owner. The ATM owner pays rent for the space. White label machine operators are willing to pay more rent, precisely because they rape their "customers" harder. (It's a lot like a porn dialler, really.) Ever notice that most stores where those machines are found also don't take Interac payments directly?

With all the service charges, I pay: * $1 for each withdrawal past 2 per month * $1.50 for interbranch banking (half goes to my bank, half to the other bank) * $1-$3.50 "convenience" fee.

I bank at PC Financial, and refuse to use any ATM other than PCF/CIBC. I haven't paid a dime in bank fees since 2000.

Re:My ATM story

[ortholattice]

Do you know what company made the cards/machines?

I am almost certain it was Diebold. While I can't recall specifically that the 1999 machines were Diebold, I do know that Diebold was used by this bank for many years around that time. All machines that I recall had a very prominent "Diebold" logo ever since the machines were introduced in the 1970's. I don't recall any other vendor.

By the way I suspect that historically the reason for the embedded PIN was that I think (I'm not positive of course) that early machines did not "phone home" to check the PIN but instead were stand-alone machines. Back then you could not use the card more than once per day (probably the usage date was written to the stripe), with a rather low maximum withdrawal of a couple hundred dollars or something, and a "cash reserve" credit approval was required for all ATM accounts. Those are my clues.

Re:cold trip

[jmagic]

I've actually used the ATM in McMurdo. It wasn't as exciting as it sounds.

History of ATM Failures

[preatorian]

There's an excellent paper that I read in school that describes various failures and hacks of ATMs over the ages. Really makes you think next time you use that ATM in the mall... Let's hope things are much more secure today.

Check it out: Why Cryptosystems Fail [cam.ac.uk]

Re:Text here

[ChairmanMeow]

At one of the local stores, they have machines that have scales to make sure you don't try to steal anything... and what inevitably happens is that if you scan something and do not place it in the bag quickly enough, the damn machine ends up in an infinite loop of "Put the item in the bag!" and "Take the item out of the bag and rescan it!" until either the cashier intervenes, or I kick the machine and it shuts up... not to mention that at any moment, at least one of the machines has crashed.

Re:cold trip

[Mateito]

The ATM in McMurdo is a Wells Fargo machine. I don't know who fills it up with cash, but if they run out, you have to walk to the closet bank: The Chilean "Banco de Creditos y Inversiones" (BCI) located at the chilean base. Its the only Bank on the continent, and there is a several-year-long waiting list for bank staff to get posted down there for six months. Usually less for the experience, and more for the "distance bonus" which is calculated on number of kilometers from home.

Chances are tho, her english won't be that great, so speak slowly. And, like all Chilean banks, they close at 2pm.