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Displays Handhelds Hardware

First Dual-emission OLED Display in a Phone 101

Posted by CowboyNeal from the both-sides-of-the-screen dept.
roc_face writes "Japanese electronics joint-venture company ELDis has come up with the world's first dual-emission organic light-emitting diode (OLED) display for a mobile phone. This means the screen can be viewed from both sides. It was on display at the annual Flat Panel Display exposition in Tokyo this week."
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First Dual-emission OLED Display in a Phone More

First Dual-emission OLED Display in a Phone

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  • Yarr (Score:4, Funny)

    by Leffe ( 686621 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:07AM (#6366364)
    Dual-emission OLED Display
    Oh my, lots of technical words :) I suspect that I'm a little after in technology. I haven't even got a cell phone :p

  • Short article (Score:2, Interesting)

    by pldms ( 136522 )
    Am I missing something? The /. summary is almost as long as the article itself.

  • hang on... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by tiled_rainbows ( 686195 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:07AM (#6366367) Homepage Journal
    Wouldn't that mean that all the text on one side of the screen would come out backwards?
    How useful is that?
    • You could make a switch that is depressed when the phone is closed and that mirrors the data on the screen. Problem solved.

    • Re:hang on... (Score:4, Informative)

      by AllenChristopher ( 679129 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:21AM (#6366414)
      Well, if the phone is closed, then the image flips around. Say for caller id, or an e-mail that's come in which can be navigated with a jog dial.

      It seems like a much better solution than those slide-out keypads on something like the Sidekick. [amazon.com] A hinge is an easier mechanism to work with.

    • Re:hang on... (Score:3, Informative)

      by JaredOfEuropa ( 526365 )
      The phone would just reverse the text when you close the flip-top cover. This technology allows you to replace the two screens that some phones have (one of each side of the flip-top, with the outside one showing caller id and such) with one screen. Simpler & cheaper.

      • One problem for PDAs. (Score:2, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward
        This is indeed great for status display on a device like a phone.

        The problem now is in tablet devices- we're seeing a shift to proper capacitative pads, instead of the topcoating matrix used in, say, early Palms and Psions. To create a 'convertible' PDA out of one of these, you're stuck with the older technology- and you'll need to apply it to both sides.

        I also wonder how well these can render black; do they have an LCD layer sandwiched in the middle?

        Verdict: Cool for embedding a TV in your living room

    • Re:hang on... (Score:2, Funny)

      by Alsee ( 515537 )
      Wouldn't that mean that all the text on one side of the screen would come out backwards?
      How useful is that?

      Tech Support: How may I help you?
      Average Caller: The computer you sold me is BROKEN!
      Tech Support: Did you drop it?
      Average Caller: NO! What do you think I am? An idiot?
      Tech Support: No no, I'm sorry. I didn't mean suggest that. So what's what's wrong with your computer?
      Average Caller: It's BROKEN!
      Tech Support: How is it broken?
      Average Caller: I don't know how it got broken!
      Tech Support: No, I mean wh

  • Cool (Score:5, Funny)

    by jorleif ( 447241 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:09AM (#6366372)
    Cool, with this device and a mirror I will be able to watch two screens showing the same image at the same time.

    Seriously though, it will make it very hard to hide from your friends what a lousy nibbles player you are.

  • I don't know if I should call it cool or useless. (Score:5, Funny)

    by mikeophile ( 647318 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:09AM (#6366376)
    I'm sure there are better uses for this tech than cell phones.

    It's all fun and games until your signifigant other sends you some homemade porn during a business meeting.

  • Applications (Score:5, Informative)

    by ubera ( 107426 ) <oconnoat@@@tcd...ie> on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:10AM (#6366377) Homepage
    It strikes me that this has a number of great applications, above mobile phone use.

    How about Roadside Signs which are readable on both sides?
    (for that "I wonder what exit I just missed feeling)

    Also, laptop displays that can be viewed on one side while an over head projector reads the other?

    I like this tech. Anyone got any numbers for brightness and power consumption?

    • Re:Applications (Score:5, Insightful)

      by mikeophile ( 647318 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:21AM (#6366413)
      With a bigger version of this kind of screen, you could play a proper game of Connect Four.

      It might be adopted pretty quickly by the military though. It would be a great upgrade to those plexiglass tactical map displays you see in every modern submarine movie.

      • Re:Applications (Score:2, Insightful)

        by wagemonkey ( 595840 )
        It might be adopted pretty quickly by the military though. It would be a great upgrade to those plexiglass tactical map displays you see in every modern submarine movie.
        Except that plexiglass doesn't need power, is pretty resistant to shaking and twisting, doesn't mind a little water, isn't affected by EMP...
        • It's very low power as displays go, and if you're out of power in a sub, your kinda screwed anyway.

          With a Lexan substrate, the OLED display will be as rugged and water-proof as the old tactical grid.

          Finally, if enough EMP penetrates the sub to fry the display, half the systems on the ship will go with it.

          Sorry, I'm just not seeing the downsides of an upgrade.

          • I thought you could run a sub for a fair while with little electrical power - most of these things have nuclear steam turbines pushing them along and I suspect the controls are hydraulic. You could then easily lose the electrical system and still fight the sub (admittedly at a disadvantage). I may be talking rubbish, but the military kind of goes for redundancy in a big way.
            I mentioned in another post the probable difficulty in scaling this thing up to make a big display. Then you need a convenient input m
            • Ok, let's say worse comes to worse with the Lexan-backed OLED tactical display.

              Power is shut down or it fails for some reason.

              What is left?

              A big sheet of plastic, exactly what they are using now.

        • "Except that plexiglass doesn't need power, is pretty resistant to shaking and twisting, doesn't mind a little water, isn't affected by EMP...
          "

          Waitaminute. You mean they are still using pencil-and-paper instead of computers to control those things down there? (same argument for against manual vs. computer navigated subs, surely?)

          • You mean they are still using pencil-and-paper instead of computers to control those things down there?

            It's a sheet of plastic and a guy writing backwards with a chinagraph pencil - or possibly an erasble OHP pen these days. That's what they use for the plot. Sure they use computers, but I would assume re-boot time would be a major worry if you're in an engagement. Do you really want a computer to re-ipl when you could have an electrical or electro-mechanical system do the same job with less worry? I'm th

      • >those plexiglass tactical map displays you see in every modern submarine movie.

        Dude, you would use them to plan your mass evacuation from Hoth when the Empire finds you.

    • Re:Applications (Score:5, Insightful)

      by G-funk ( 22712 ) <josh@gfunk007.com> on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:23AM (#6366421) Homepage Journal
      How about Roadside Signs which are readable on both sides?

      Or they could just mount another piece of metal on the other side of the poles... I wonder which would be cheaper?
      • another piece of metal

        Road signs that can be updated depending on the traffic conditions are already in use in some locations. A version where you could look in your mirror and see the mirrored image on the back of the sign might be convenient in some situations.

    • Re:Applications (Score:2, Informative)

      by sleeper0 ( 319432 )
      i dont think they'd use it for street signs wouldnt one side always be shown in reverse?

      It seems to me that you would use this tech on those pda's/laptops that have a swivel screen to eiter be used with a keyboard or cover up the keyboard to be used like a pad. Those swivel screens must be hell to design well compared to a switch that just makes the screen draw in reverse.
      • i dont think they'd use it for street signs wouldnt one side always be shown in reverse?

        Making it perfect for viewing through the rear-view mirror. :-) Haven't you ever seen an ambulance?

        But I agree, laptops, pdas, etc would be a better use, perhaps televisions, maps...you name it, if you can look at it, you can use this for it.

    • One of the major reasons why this technology is limited to small applications can be found in its name and specifically in the word Organic. These things are basically made of of carbon, which because of its higher valency (than silicon) will readilly react with oxygen to form Co2 and give off heat. Consequently these things are likely to catch fire if left anywhere near even a moderate source of heat and could even produce a major problem with regard to global warning as when they are thrown away the carbo

    • How about Roadside Signs which are readable on both sides? (for that "I wonder what exit I just missed feeling)

      Neat idea, but see, we've already got this technology we like to call "paint".

      • Are they used? I have never seen a painted double sided sign.

        Also, I think there are advantages to a
        dynamic content for the signs.
  • now you can make the fliper on your phone out of it and be able to see the screen if your phone is opened or closed oh and it would be backwards but the phone can easly detect wether the phone is open or closed and mirror it acordingly all we need now is to build the rest of the hard ware into the screen so all we would just have a screen nothing else then we could have properly skinable phones

  • Great.. (Score:4, Funny)

    by magnesius666 ( 672431 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:12AM (#6366381)
    So, next time my girlfriend sends me a... suggesting picture of hers on my mob, you get to see it too?

  • Hmmmm ... (Score:3, Funny)

    by the bluebrain ( 443451 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:12AM (#6366385)
    Not quite.

    Now, if the back of the screen showed the back of the picture, too ....

    [*bibilip* ... *bibilip* ...]
    [glances at closed flip-open phone]
    - "Dude. Bad hair day?"

    :)

  • Coming to a laptop near you (Score:5, Informative)

    by icke ( 661710 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:13AM (#6366391)
    Here's an informative article [economist.com] from The Economist [economist.com] which explains that we should soon be able to mould screens and use them in broad daylight.

  • Sigh (Score:5, Insightful)

    by FosterSJC ( 466265 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:17AM (#6366404)
    OK Guys- the jokes about using a mirror to see both screens and spinning your phone fast are not that funny. This has serious uses, not to mention it is a great example of the mythical OLED technology finally coming to market. For example: you know how your flip phone has that single line of text for caller ID or whatever on the outside? What if it had a whole screen, and you could see the person's picture when the called. How about if it were a viewfinder for a now-smaller ELF like camera? It is clunky moving an open phone around to take pictures. Now you can have Geiss like effects when you listen to your phone as an MP3 Player too. In other words, it just provides the possibility and the convenience of doing everything (non-call related) with the phone closed, that you normally require the phone open for.
    • Since you seem to know something about these devices I might as well ask for some clarifications. Is it one screen that displays in both directions or two screens on top of each other? If it is the former then isn't the other screen "mirrored" rendering text pretty hard to read? Of course pictures usually work equally good no matter if they are mirrored or not.

      In the camera example one could use software to invert the mirroring, if the phone is open the inner display shows text the right way, if the phone
      • No, as far as I know it is only one screen. It displays in two directions since it does not require the elaborate electronics behind it that an LCD screen does. So, theoretically, people on the outside can see what you are seeing, only mirrored, as you said. However, it is very simple to have the phone check to see if it closed or not, and, if it is, display the text so that it can be properly read when it is closed. I hope that is clear, if not, ask and I will try to clarify. I know it is silly, but I
    • For example: you know how your flip phone has that single line of text for caller ID or whatever on the outside? What if it had a whole screen, and you could see the person's picture when the called.

      This has already been done. See the Nokia 7650, Nokia 3650 and Sagem MY X-6 for three examples.

      How about if it were a viewfinder for a now-smaller ELF like camera? It is clunky moving an open phone around to take pictures.

      Look out for the Samsung P400. It doesn't use OLED technology but the entire display

  • well i guess we'll call them Japanese walls.

  • I suppose dual-emmission sounds more impressive... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by magickalhack ( 648733 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @08:29AM (#6366444) Homepage
    They consume much less power than current devices and have faster response times.

    This seems like a much more interesting fact about them than that they can be viewed from both sides. I suppose one could take advantage of the dual-viewable nature, but it seems like something we already have an adaquate solution for: place a screen on each surface you want to have a screen on. Duh! ;-)

    On the other hand, I suppose the 2 sided viewability could be potentially beneficial to hybrid tablet PCs, which until now have had to rely on fragile-looking swivel mechanisms to rotate the screen between laptop and tablet functionality.

    Any indication as to whether or not the images on each side are identical (i.e. the back is a mirror image of the front) or if they can be controlled independantly?
  • Some more ideas If you can also see through the display, it could have all sorts of head-up display uses. Not that I think you should be on the phone when you're flying that euro-fighter. It might also make battleships a viable game for 2 on a mobile. We need to know about whether the two sides if the display can display different things.
  • Dual-emission OLED Display That just SOUNDS like cancer. I thought one emission point was enough.
    • So THAT'S how Dr. Banner in the tv series exposed himself to all that gamma radiation. That dual-emission display gave double the amount of radiation when he thought he was only getting half that. Silly me. Why didn't I see it before?

      Perhaps they'll need a warning label:

      *DANGER* Too much exposure to this screen may lead to unintended skin pigment changes along with growth in body mass.

      Wait, that can be said for all screens... erm, yeah.
  • It is obvious why it is dual display: because it is on a flip phone. When the phone is closed, it will just mirror the image so it looks normal on the other side. This will make the phone a lot cheaper and have a lot of functions because now designers can dedicate more of the phone to a big screen... You don't have to have the cheap little monochrome lcd on the outside for caller id or something.

  • Wow. (Score:5, Funny)

    by Faust7 ( 314817 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @09:00AM (#6366551) Homepage
    To this day is it not known how the ancient Egyptians managed to build the pyramids without being able to read their cell phones from both sides. One theory suggests rotary technology; more audacious mavericks wonder if they perhaps did not have phones at all.
    • Perhaps the most plausible theory of them all is that the aliens which built the pyramids did indeed have cell phone veiwabl;e from both sides. Many scientists behind this theory believe that this is what enabled them to pull off such feats.
    • So you're trying to tell me that I'd get more done if I didn't have my mob (well, we call them handies)?

      That's ridiculous. Next you'd tell me I'd be more productive without my Microsoft Productivity Package!!!

      Or... *gasp* my computer.

      WITH INTERNET?!??

      That does it. I'm headed off to a different Slashdot forum.
  • Reading Slashdot before putting your glasses on can be MUCH more interesting.

    I saw:

    First Dual-emission OLEO Display in a Phone

    How neat would that be? A margarine-based display? Talk about low production costs!

  • See-through clear pixels (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Cthefuture ( 665326 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @10:17AM (#6366933)
    I wonder if they have a version that has or can make the pixels clear.

    That would be cool. Imagine a large wall that has graphics on it but is also translucent. You know, like those screens you always see in sci-fi movies. Add some touch sensors...
    • mmm, unless I am really missing something, all LCD's are transparant. That is how the backlight manages to shine through them. (btw I am talking about the old style LCD like in the old handheld vid games. I think modern screens are the same but I am guessing here)

      The LCD itself is just a piece of glass. The reason that you can't see through them is because they put something behind it to either reflect light back, or the backlight itself. But you can keep a LCD transparant. I seen them used in clocks.

      • mmm, unless I am really missing something :) oopsie.

        These are not LCD's. They are self illuminating and do not use backlighting. Also colorful. And from the look of the photo they do not appear to be translucent, but it's hard to tell.

        If they could be made clear though... wow, it would look awesome. It would not be like a LCD because OLED's produce colorful light.
  • There's all this talk about "ELDis", but I can't seem to find them on the net. Anyone have an URL for them?

    Also, I remember an article in Scientific American a couple of years ago about trying to create a display that was made of small particles, which could be rotated (or something like that) into the proper position to show the proper color. It was proposed as a great idea for e-books. First, because b&w was easiest. Second, because once the particles where in the proper position, no more power n

  • poor design (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 04, 2003 @10:42AM (#6367072)
    Ok guys, the major problem with OLED's is lifetime. In particular, they die after a certain number of Coulombs of charge have been pumped through them (while they are at a given temperature! increase the temp by 10 deg C and the lifetime drops in half!). So this means the total number of photons you get out is limiting. You want it bright so you can see it outside as well. This means that you generally want ALL the photons going to the viewer (using reflective matrix or lenticular material, etc.) to help do this. If half the photons go out the back, you have to drive it twice as hard to get the same usable brightness! Bad idea...

    • See http://www.usdc.org/technical/downloads/Web_Repor t _0101/sld027.htm which is a Philips slide saying a 640x480 display will draw 28W. Not for my laptop, thanks. This is why all the bigger displays are 1 off demos for hype, and only the very small ones (about 2" diagonal max) are in production.

      The other big problem is phosphor life which varies with colour (blue is worst) and getting 10k hours is very difficult unless temperature is kept moderate.

      However, these displays look very good, although maybe t
    • "If half the photons go out the back, you have to drive it twice as hard to get the same usable brightness! Bad idea..."

      But they look so cool! Honestly, they do look cool, and that will drive research to improve their lifetime, since a product like this will be popular and the company that is doing the R&D for the cellphones with this tech will know this. First generation tech, just like x.0 software releases aren't always great, but they get better in time.
  • Its got mufflers? Is there something about OLEDs that I missed??
  • You could fasshion several of these in front of eachother and get a 3D image could you not?

    or possibly into a box shape if you had an assured angle of perspective.

    seems like a wast on a cell phone but I'm glad they finally showed up

  • TOLED double-sided see-thru screens (Score:3, Interesting)

    by kobotronic ( 240246 ) on Friday July 04, 2003 @12:24PM (#6367665)
    http://www.universaldisplay.com/toled.php

    Soon we'll see all kinds of different neat OLED tech. Smart windows can be transparent, with a lo-rez LCD layer forming solid black backgrounds behind the windows of a transparent OLED display panel. You can imagine embedding this on a mirror or anywhere there is a glass surface, providing full-contrast see-thru windows. Imagine bank tellers and ticket counters of the future -- the display will be right in the middle of the transaction area, with both parties seeing the same image, flipped appropriately on either side. Cool stuff. I want a 50 inch diagonal fishtank that turns into a color television when switched on!
  • If you press a mirror against the back of this, will the reflected light double the brightness seen from the front?

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