Apple Marketing Hypes New PowerMacs 1022
Wacky_Wookie was only one of many who wrote in with a mention of Apple's "leak" of specifications for a new line of PowerMacs to be dubbed "G5", apparently running the new PowerPC 970 CPUs. No offense, but anyone who thinks it was a mistake or leak doesn't understand marketing. :) Update by J : In case those linked sites get taken down too, try
MacNN.
New Mac (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes... (Score:2, Interesting)
Well, I'd love to be that guy, as he will probably get a big promotion for generating even more interest into Apple's upcoming event.
My analysis of why this is fake. (Score:-1, Interesting)
- 1.6GHz, 1.8GHz or Dual 2GHz PowerPC G5 Processors
It's not a G5, it's a PPC970, completely different beasts. Not to mention neither Motorola or IBM have 2GHz chips in their roadmap until 2005. Bzzzt One point impossible
- Up to 1GHz processor bus
1GHz bus? gimme a break. Intel hasn't yet reached this. Two points impossible
- Up to 8GB of DDR SDRAM
This one is acceptable
- Fast Serial ATA hard drives
This is also possible
- AGP 8X Pro graphics options from NVIDIA or ATI
Almost believable, but for the moment Apple are phasing out the use of NVIDIA cards in their machines. I highly doubt they'll be used. Half a point impossible
- Three USB 2.0 ports
The rest of Apples site would say "3 USB Ports" not "Three". Also, Apple have a long standing habit of using Firewire instead of USB 2.0. I take this as one point impossible
- One FireWire 800, two FireWire 400 ports
Once again use of the verbal "One" instead of the numeric. Only one FW800 port? Why would Apple stick with FireWire 400 anyway? I mark this impossible
- Bluetooth & AirPort Extreme ready
Likely
- Optical and analog audio in and out
Bad grammar, but optical audio in a graphics machine? I'm sorry but this sounds like wishful thinking. One more point impossible.
In total, that's 4 and a half impossible features out of ten. If you're waiting on this machine, you'll be waiting a LONG time people.
But... (Score:2, Interesting)
And heads will roll for the poor souls who accidently updated the store to early.
mmmmm, NUMA! (Score:5, Interesting)
Would these be CHRP (common hardware ref. platform) compliant? Or has apple abandoned that? Cuz then you could run MacOS, or Linux, or AIX all native on the same box.
Parent is deluded (Score:4, Interesting)
Revealing indeed, but not of what you think.
- 1.6GHz, 1.8GHz or Dual 2GHz PowerPC G5 Processors
It's not a G5, it's a PPC970, completely different beasts. Not to mention neither Motorola or IBM have 2GHz chips in their roadmap until 2005. Bzzzt One point impossible
G5 = branding. And IBM have 2.5 GHz chips in their roadmap for 2004 (in the new blades) so 2 GHz in 2003 isn't that odd.
- Up to 1GHz processor bus
1GHz bus? gimme a break. Intel hasn't yet reached this. Two points impossible
Read the specs of the PPC 970, freely available all over the internet. The bus runs at 1/2 the processor speed, hence 2 GHz is 1GHz bus. Even the 1.8 GHz chips, which are definitely announced by IBM for other products, have 900 MHz buses.
- Up to 8GB of DDR SDRAM
This one is acceptable
- Fast Serial ATA hard drives
This is also possible
- AGP 8X Pro graphics options from NVIDIA or ATI
Almost believable, but for the moment Apple are phasing out the use of NVIDIA cards in their machines. I highly doubt they'll be used. Half a point impossible
They're not "phasing out" anything; at the time they introduced the latest powermacs, ATI simply had better cards available.
- Three USB 2.0 ports
The rest of Apples site would say "3 USB Ports" not "Three". Also, Apple have a long standing habit of using Firewire instead of USB 2.0. I take this as one point impossible
The current MDD powermacs already have USB 2.0. That the next models should also have it is not surprising in the least.
- One FireWire 800, two FireWire 400 ports
Once again use of the verbal "One" instead of the numeric. Only one FW800 port? Why would Apple stick with FireWire 400 anyway? I mark this impossible
Because FW800 is not backwards compatible. The connector is physically different. They have to stick with 400 for now.
- Bluetooth & AirPort Extreme ready
Likely
- Optical and analog audio in and out
Bad grammar, but optical audio in a graphics machine? I'm sorry but this sounds like wishful thinking. One more point impossible.
This one does puzzle me slightly, but Apple don't consider their machines "graphics machines". Macs are all-purpose. It's no fault of Apple if they are pigeonholed by others as "only for graphics". Also, even if they were "graphics machines," video editing kind of requires sound...
In total, that's 4 and a half impossible features out of ten. If you're waiting on this machine, you'll be waiting a LONG time
I make that 0 impossible features, and one odd one. Come Monday, you will be feeling very silly.
Re:Well then... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:My analysis of why this is fake. (Score:3, Interesting)
geez, and the pentium iii wasn't much of an upgrade over the pentium II, right? it could be just a name used for marketing. maybe they want to avoid a situation where a ppc970 seems as awkward a mouthful to say as "Pentium II celeron".
I will concede to you on the 2ghz.. that was a suprise to me as well.
i guess you were pretty incredulous when the Athlon came out with a double data rate bus before Intel. Intel does not corner the market on chip innovation: Hypertransport, for example, is pretty much something that Intel has nothing to do with either.
guess you missed the bulletin that USB 2.0 chipsets are on new powermacs [macrumors.com] right now...
becuase fw400 and 800 use different plugs? becuase there are mostly FW400 perhipherals available? i could think of all sorts of reasons. the 17" cafeteria tray powerbook has only one FW800...
yeah it's whishful thinking. but hell, if the Creative Labs Audigy can have a SPDIF input and output, why not a mac? What kind of moron does audio on a mac? oh Skywalker Sound and Aphex Twin. i mean, have you ever heard of Protools [protools.com]?
maybe it's going to be a big hoax and we'll all look like dupes. but saying that these things are "impossible" makes me think you've been reading too much PC propaganda.
Re:powerbooks (Score:5, Interesting)
:)
Re:New Mac (Score:2, Interesting)
Actually, the G5 and Panther (OS update) are rumored to be 64-bit [macrumors.com]. You might see 64-bit on a Mac first.
Insane speed! (Score:3, Interesting)
Two 970's at 2 GHz with bus bandwith! Earlier (leaked) numbers of tests put the 970 at between 1.5 and 2.5 times as fast as a pentium 4. That makes these machines the equivalent of a 6-10 GHz machine. Now of course, we'll have to wait and see and two procs are not doubly as efficient as one but great news this would be nonetheless.
Oh yeah.
PCI-X ??? Already ??? (Score:2, Interesting)
However, here [slashdot.org]... or better : here [pcisig.com], it sounds like it is not yet ready...
But well, on the other hand, Apple was using 802.11g before the spec actually got approved, so why not...
Re:Well then... (Score:1, Interesting)
But the Macophiles only compose 4% of the total market for PCs. If Apple wants to start commanding a bigger piece of the pie, they need to start lowering the cost of the machines. I don't think we'll ever see a sub $1000 machine, but we will start getting more bang for the buck.
Re:No... (Score:2, Interesting)
Now, can someone please write a bot that trots out both sides of the Mac religionist argument so that those of us who simply find Apple's activities interesting can ignore one post instead of dozens? Thenkyew.
Comment removed (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:My analysis of why this is fake. (Score:3, Interesting)
Some of your analysis is negated by looking at Apple's marjeting house style a bit more closely.
The rest of Apples site would say "3 USB Ports" not "Three". Also, Apple have a long standing habit of using Firewire instead of USB 2.0. I take this as one point impossible
Apple uses words for numbers less then 10 all over the place. This is generally considered good style in old-fashioned publishing circles (that is, those who believe they exist to create something that people will read, rather than something that fills the space between the ads).
For example, from the first Apple page I bothered to examine (http://www.apple.com/powermac/specs.html)
"Four 3.5-inch hard drive expansion bays"
"Four DIMM slots"
"One AGP 4X slot with graphics card installed"
and so on.
Off the style subject, as Apple now ships USB 2.0-capable iPods, it's not hard to believe USB 2.0 PowerMacs.
optical audio in a graphics machine?
Macs are widely used in professional audio circles. Go hang out in any Mac IRC channel - wall-to-wall musos.
Don't believe it. (Score:5, Interesting)
While I'd love to believe that Apple is soon coming out with 970 based machines, these two items in particular are the Joe Slashdot wet-dream wishlist items. Apple will go with the same drives you can get in an Xserve today, and I'd be pretty surprised if the jumped on board PCI-X. The fact is, someone not related to Apple just sat at their keyboard, and tried to make a spec which seemed believable yet got all the Joe Slashdot Apple fanboys hot-and-bothered.
Furthermore, as I'm sure has been mentioned before, this is absolutely not how Apple's marketing engine works. They keep the upcoming hardware stricktly under wraps to discourage the wait-until-the-next-machine-comes-out mentality. They are a profitable company, and they'd like to keep it that way. The way for them to do this is to entice you to buy a machine today.
Too Good To Be True (Score:2, Interesting)
If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
I suspect someone hacked the site.
I will be absolutely delighted to eat my words if I'm proven wrong. But I'm not gonna set myself up for a fall by expecting machines with these specs.
$$$$$$$$Money (Score:3, Interesting)
The main reason that I'll be waiting for is the ability to be able to put together a pretty good system for $600. I love MacOS, but until they go after the low end, there are a lot of us who will keep dual-booting linux (or BSD) and windows. No troll or flame here, but isn't it about time that Apple offered a Mac for less than $1000 that isn't completely ancient (ie, no 600 MHz iMac please). Why do they still completely forsake the low end?
Re:My analysis of why this is fake. (Score:3, Interesting)
Sorry bob. I was on the Apple web site last night and caught this before even it appeared on the rumor sites. I even have a screen snapshot of the entire window.
This is genuine material. The entire page spoke of the current G4 line, but the small quick spec list next to a G4 machine photo actually listed the new G5 specs.
Now, is it a genuine mistake? I would tend to believe so, as Jobs is really pissy about keeping his secret punches for the keynote.
Mind you, his big secret may be the new 15.4 inch rumored laptop. There was even talk of a dual G5 17" laptop, but I give little credence to that.
Re:New Mac (Score:5, Interesting)
Oh sure. So the legendary Apple marketing machine will whip up a hyped frenzy in its followers. But other than being in the running again, nothing will have really changed.
Well, nothing at all, except for the fact that Macs might be faster than practically anything out there now, as opposed to before, when they were definitely not.
Home users care nothing for 'vendor independence', etc. They usually just buy the cheapest machine that has the specs they want.
The *really* big news is that a huge chunk of the geek-set here on Slashdot will soon have a really, really compelling alternative to any high-end PC workstation. If the IBM chip scales up fast, Apple is looking very well positioned to displace a few SGI and Sun machines in certain situations.
Think about it - almost everyone on here drools over Mac OS X - rightly so - but they had problems with the slower bus/clock speeds on the G4s (whether justified or not; I still suspect a lot of these goons screaming for speed just want it for Doom 3). With 64bit dual-Ghz high-speed-bus Macs, you will see an even larger migration of those Unix geeks to the Mac. Something I look forward to.
I'm not an Apple apologist by any means - I use the big 3 platforms pretty regularly - but let's give credit where its due, huh?
Re:Well then... (Score:3, Interesting)
excellent, Smithers (Score:3, Interesting)
1) What do they look like?
and the performance-relevant one:
2) Is it dual-channel DDR, or did Apple pull an Apple and make it single-channel? This is critical, as they do NOT want these things bandwidth-starved like Macs have traditionally been.
The hope meter is waaaaay up today, though.
When will Apple offer a WUXGA powerbook? (Score:2, Interesting)
Supposedly OS X 10.3 is going to allow even better resolution scaling, so there should be no problems with fonts being to small.
Dara
Why could this NOT have been a hack/crack? (Score:3, Interesting)
Bigger Suprise (Score:2, Interesting)
It's a setup y'all (Score:1, Interesting)
Since this 'error' appears to have arisen from simply uploading the wrong image, it's validity can be easily disproven.
The Sources:
[1] *** PowerMac G4 Buyers Page - Apple Store US ***
http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObj
[2] *** PowerMac G4 Buyers Page - Apple Store UK ***
http://store.apple.com/Apple/WebObjects/ukst
[3] *** 'Modded' G5 Buyers Page ***
http://www.thinksecret.com/cgi-bin/pic.cgi?i
[4] *** 'Modded' G5 GIF ***
http://www.thinksecret.com/cgi-bin/pic.cgi?i
The reasoning:
1. With reference to the G4 Buyers Page, the text on the US site reads 'Choose your PowerMac G4'. It is NOT prefixed by 'Step 1'. 'Step 1' does however appear on the UK site [2], but in this case you are urged to 'Select' and not 'Choose' your G4. The site image in question [3] appears to pertain to the US site.
2. As the error is supposedly attributable to an erroneous upload, saving the original specifications GIF image from source [1] will give an idea of the intended alignment of the GIFs. You can see that the current GIF is justified by its left edge to the banner text above (Choose your...). It is clear that the 'modded' GIF [4] would not justify with the original layout in [1] as depicted falsely in the claimed G5 page [3].
3. Furthermore, if the 'modded' GIF [4] was indeed uploaded in lieu of, there ought to be greater vertical separation from the banner text (Choose your...) and the specifications text. This is the case in [1], but not in [3].
4. I am sure Apple must have a few editorial guidelines to stick to. In this case, comparison of the editorial in the current spec image [1] and the 'modded' image [3] shows up the following typos or inconsistencies:
4a. 'The world's fastest' as opposed to 'The World's fastest'
4b. The use of hyphens to highlight specs, as opposed to the leading text format currently used [1], [2]
4c. Why are the processor speeds listed in ascending order? Typical Apple practice is to list from fastest to slowest (see iMac)
4d. Why are quantities specified by words, where they were previously specified by numerals - read 'three' USB 2.0 ports cf. '4' USB ports.
4e. AGP is referred to as 8X as opposed to 8x [note case]
Summary: intriguing and desirable specs, but inconsistent enough to make Monday the only real decider.
Here's why forsaking the low end is not smart (Score:2, Interesting)
All right, if you want to play red-herring, the sector that was previously thought unprofitable includes well over 99% of the people now using any computer.
Of course they know how to tap it. It's obvious. Sell a cheap-ass product with no distinguishing features, no customer service, no innovation, and no user experience to speak of, by the millions. Apple just doesn't want to be that company.
Apple is a successful, profitable company. 18/20 profitable quarters! That's amazing! What makes you think they give a damn about increasing their market share significantly?
Dell. Probably 20/20 profitable quarters, and it didn't need MS to prop it up. Point is that there is a damned lot of profit to be made, and Dell does it selling virtually all their home machines below Apple's entry level.
Basically, all I want is their damned OS, they can shove their supposedly superior hardware. I don't need customer service, as I know what the fuck I'm doing, and I don't consider a color scheme to be an innovation. Just give me the OS on something that doesn't cost $1500 for entry-level.
And I'll tell you why they should give a damn - they make big talk about being accessible, and not being elitist, but their price points put them outside either A) the rich, or B) ideologues that eat raman noodles 3 meals a day for 6 months so they can afford one. And it's a really dumb idea to forsake a segment of the market that doesn't make $30,000 (like say students at non-ivy-league schools). I went to state school, and Apple had NO marketshare - they simply cost too much to even be an option. As a result, all my friends from college either still use windows or switched to linux - but I don't know a single person from undergrad who used a mac. And those buying preferences continue once ingrained.
Re:New Mac (Score:2, Interesting)
I STILL have not seen points in your original post. The grandparent poster pointed out, correctly, that you didn't back up any of your statements with anything remotely resembling factual or logical evidence.
I'm going home. 3 troll-modded posts in row is a record. OK guys, I've learnt my lesson. You don't like people who don't like Macs. Fine. Bye bye.
Good, we won't have to deal with your drivel.
The problem with open forums is that people expect their opinions to be self-evident. You won't convince us to think how you think until you can show us (a) why you think that way and (b) that it's a more correct way to think. These requirements are not met without evidence and/or logic supporting the claims you make.
Re:No, it certainly wasn't intentional (Score:4, Interesting)
They "leak" these specs out and it generates a huge buzz, especially when they send out cease and desists to the major rumors sites. I think Apple has actually learned how to use the rumor sites to help them generate buzz. They play these leak then cease and desist games knowing it will make people even more curious about what else was NOT leaked out, or will be more likely to watch the show just to see the new machines in action.
This will ensure a very large number of people watch their broadcast of the show. This means developers as well, ones who may not have watched this otherwise (i.e. PC software developers) but are now intrigued by this new machine buzz. It means they will see, along with the new machines being confirmed, Apple's demo of OS X 10.3, which is what Apple really wants them to see. After all, OS X is Apple's future as much as new hardware is and if they can get these guys to sit through a presentation on OS X and how easy it is to develop while watiting to see what new iron Apple has out, they might get the hint of "Wow, OS X is really cool! Along with this new hardware these guys will be going places! I think I'll get one of these and see how easy it will be to port my software over to this amazing platform".
It will also draw PC user eyeballs as well, and they will also see how cool OS X is compared to Windows. So in a way, this could well be a ploy to glue more eyeballs on the screen and fill people with marketing about OS X along with the new machines they are now so curious about.
Re:Yay! (Score:5, Interesting)
I just realized that the new Power Macs would be the RS-6000 wannabe workstation for people who couldn't afford the real deal.
Both the Apple and IBM machines now have 64-bit Power 4-derived CPUs, gigabytes of RAM, decent graphics, etc. The IBM machine will certainly stand out as the workstation that overdosed on steroids, and the new Power Mac will be better suited to those who value moderation in all things.
PCI-X != PCI Express (Score:3, Interesting)
It is merely an extension of the PCI 2.1
PCI Express is a completely different spec, with backwards compatibility as a bolt-on option. After adoption, expect to see your old PCI 2.1 / 2.2 slots disappear and have only PCI Express slots available.
PCI express was just demo'd and referenced at Intel Developer Forum this spring, and Intel isn't expected to have it on their own boards until the Xeon "Twin Castle" chipset ships in '04. As it is an open standard, expect Apple, AMD, IBM, SiS, and VIA to follow suit in about the same time frame.
marketing? (Score:2, Interesting)
No offense, but anyone who thinks this is marketing doesn't understand Steve Jobs. I'm sure someone got fired over this.
Re:performance (Score:2, Interesting)
Specs may be fake according to Dutch website (Score:3, Interesting)