Permanet vs. Nearlynet 58
Clay Shirky has a good essay on wireless networking, contrasting two approaches to building out a network, roughly akin to the cathedral and bazaar methods of building software.
Living on Earth may be expensive, but it includes an annual free trip around the Sun.
the problem with wireless networking (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, duh. Most people don't like to spend $40 on anything, let alone a phone call. I don't understand how businesses think that hey, if we're dealing with other business people, they'll want to throw money around like it was candy! Treat them like other people (ie: cheap) and you'll find you have more realistic expectations.
Re:the problem with wireless networking (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:the problem with wireless networking (Score:1)
qwantz.com (Score:1)
Collective Funding (Score:1, Insightful)
The private
Air phones disconnected due to 9-11 (Score:2)
I flew American in January (2003) and regular cellphones were banned, as well. In fact, one of the pilots came back to the passenger section on one of my flights and demanded that a passenger turn off his cellphone immediately. I quess the crew had some way of monitoring active cell connections, or something (or maybe the stewardess went and reported him
Re:Air phones disconnected due to 9-11 (Score:2, Informative)
Depends on the carrier maybe, I used US Air.
Re:Air phones disconnected due to 9-11 (Score:1)
Re:Air phones disconnected due to 9-11 (Score:1)
I always thought cell-phones were banned because they might interfere with navigation-systems, but I am not an expert. If they only didn't work, people should see that after trying to turn them on and give up.
Future market on the horizon (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Future market on the horizon (Score:1)
What I'm talking about is the stress that comes as a result of always being connected to other people shomehow, via phone lines, radio, internet, etc.
Re:Future market on the horizon (Score:2)
Microsoft: Ahead of Its Time (Score:4, Funny)
false dichotomy (Score:1)
Re:false dichotomy (Score:2, Interesting)
While we don't tend to think of steel as high tech anymore, there is a school of thought that suggests the impacts of steel on architecture have only begun to be felt. What we've seen so far are only primitive first steps compared to what we will inevitably end up with as we continue to create new ste
Re:false dichotomy (Score:4, Interesting)
I didn't get from the article that he disparages the nearlynet - in fact, he credits nearlynets for pushing permanets out. In his examples - iridium and airphones - he describes how the nearlynet - cell phones and wifi - has lower cost of entry and use, and as such, will tend to win over the more expensive permanets.
Permanets seem to have more innovative solutions, but the cost of building out these permanets means that the cost-benefit ratio rarely works out - people just don't need to be connected that badly.
My only question that just popped into my head: the Internet was built-out as an extension of a government program. If the Internet had been a private sector project, would it have been built? It seems to have all the earmarks of a permanet as described in the article... a fairly expensive and permanent build-out phase, and during the build-out phase, very little benefit to balance out the cost. It was only fairly heavy government subsidies that helped the Internet become a reality and make it affordable for anyone to get on.
It's an interesting thought. If the government building out the Internet helped make it affordable enough - would doing the same with, say, Iridium have helped? Could we have been carrying around sat phones at this point had it been a government project that was then opened up to the public? It kind of helps make the taxes that are going to, say, NASA, make sense - because perhaps, one of their projects might be the next Internet.
Re:false dichotomy (Score:4, Interesting)
Prodigy, Compuserve, AOL all attempted it, but I think they were all doomed to the extent they tried to maintain walled gardens.
The nearlynet/permanet problem has also been exacerbated by the walled garden approach, I think.
Re:false dichotomy (Score:2)
Re:false dichotomy (Score:1)
I would also mention that it's a lot easier, in general, to start with a cheap system and improve it than it is to start with a good system and cheapen it. Think of the Internet vs. the ISS.
summary (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:The link to the article is down ... (Score:1)
Economic issues, not technical issues (Score:1)
In my sense, after reading through the article, I have no new clue about building wifi networks...
Thought it would contain technical things, I'm a bit disappointed..
But they are important to remember (Score:4, Insightful)
Sure as a tech I can design a network to be avaiable anywhere. (Even on airplanes during takeoff/landing, where most electronic devices are banned) However this artical make it clear that I shouldn't spend my time doing that unless someone is watching the overall ecconmic costs. Sure as an engineer that isn't my prime responsibility, but I should be aware that other issues exist, and if they are not being watched by someone who understand them (which I likely don't) then I should expect the project to fail.
It has been said that most technological project fails because of bad management. I believe it, because I've seen it. Engineers may not understand or know these issues, but it is the job of management to know they exist and solve them. Technical problems can be solved if resources are unlimited (Mostly money, but sometimes other). However that is not the case. Many projects have solved all the technological problems, but the cost was so high that nobody could afford them.
manners over reality. (Score:2)
This is the general pattern of the defeat of permanet by nearlynet. In the context of any given system, permanet is the pattern that makes communication ubiquitou
the cathedral and the bazaar method... (Score:1)
Re:the cathedral and the bazaar method... (Score:1)
For some reason I doubt you've actually read the Cathedral and the Bazaar. You talk about all Bazaar but no Cathedral and yet refer to the two in the same breath. Maybe I'm wrong. But I really don't see how this:
makes any sense. Is it evoling in a Catherdral manner? Or a Bazaar manner? Or both, which I suppose is possible (as is the case with software) but I don't really think that was the id
Nearlynet? No way! (Score:1)
Nearlynet will win: (Score:2)
Augmented reality changes the user pattern (Score:1)
Now they are, yes, but augmented reality [unisa.edu.au] (AR) could change that. AR is pretty much the killer app for mobile internet. When HUDs are small enough to clip on a pair of glasses, you'll want constant internet access.
Of course, this doesn't automatically make 3G the winn
not everyone wants permanet (Score:1)
using cell phones on planes (Score:1)
From then on, you're not supposed to use your phone, but it will still work and people who have been detained for hours on airplanes on the ground ("waiting for the part to arrive") will often use their phones.
Not Cathedral/Bazaar! (Score:5, Insightful)
The underlying idea is that the "right" way isn't always the best, but rather, that the "best" way is what is "good enough" for cheap.
This is the same force that makes Linux compete against *nix, and is also responsible for the rise of Microsoft against vastly superior technologies.
Failure of the Essay (Score:4, Insightful)
Simple example: I can't get cell phone reception in the basement of the building I work in. The building has many wireless services, but the only one with antennas in the basement is the Facilities walkie-talkie system.
It will never be cost-effective for a wireless phone company to provide us with better cellular service in our little basement, but it is worthwhile for me to have phone access everywhere in the building. What are the alternatives?
Land-line phones at regular intervals throughout the building so it is easy to get to a phone.
A pager network to know when someone wants to reach you.
A private exchange telephone service (a la original PCS concept), with antennas distributed as required. ...but other people have different needs! Someone else needs their blackberry, and another person needs the iPaq and 802.11.
Ultimately, the only viable solution is software defined radio devices, which take advantage of whatever distribution mechanisms are available.
To put it in terms of the article, the best permanet is a loose network of nearlynets....
Re:Failure of the Essay (Score:1)
How do cellphone companies try/plan to get signals inside basements?
Apples and Oranges (Score:1)
Humans ARE a nearlynet (Score:1)
Wifi is 100% on target (Score:3, Interesting)
When I am staying somewhere for a while on a trip, I stay in a hotel with ethernet, that gives me connectivity. I just bought a Samsung i330, which is a PDA/Cel combo... I have it because I've never carried a PDA, but I always carry my phone, now I'll have a PDA with me.
One trip, I didn't have connectivity, and dialing in was driving me crazy. Across the street from my hotel was a Coffee shop with a Wifi point, so I went and got coffee and checked my email before starting my day.
If Sprint would be useful and let me use my laptop via the phone (which can supposedly be done, just need the cables), I may use it when at a hotel. The $10/day for broadband is fine, but if I didn't have to worry, that would be great.
However, when I'm not in my hotel, I have 0 need for real connectivity. I'll set up a private email that forwards to the phone, but if you need me when I'm traveling, you call me. If you send me a file, I get it when I get back to my hotel.
Nearlynet is sufficient, and there is no reason to pay a premium for more connectivity than that. Permanet (3G) will likely fail, because what people WANT is a reasonably inexpensive unmetered service. Metered is annoying, I don't want to think, should I spend $3 on this service this time. $10/mo. is an easy to justify business expense, and doesn't require individually making the decision.
Alex
3G is flat rate now... Shirky's asleep! (Score:3, Informative)
It may not be everyone's idea of the mythical 3G, but Verizon's Express Network offers flat-rate, unilmited use for $99 per month. The advertised speed is 144kbps.
tempting argument, but... (Score:1)
two things: