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Hardware

Another Xbox Anatomy Lesson 495

Posted by timothy from the lookit-th'-extra-ram-space dept.
Keith writes: "Icrontic.com has taken apart, examined, and modified an Xbox. In their latest article, they point out some debugging leads on the Xbox, and a possible USB hack. The Xbox is looking more and more like a PC." A lot of the investigation here is incomplete; watch this space, because it won't be long until Xbox surgery is commonplace.
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Another Xbox Anatomy Lesson More

Another Xbox Anatomy Lesson

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  • X term (Score:3, Interesting)

    by SETY ( 46845 ) on Sunday November 18, 2001 @10:16PM (#2582767)
    Could this be used as a (relativly) cheap X Terminal?

    • Re:X term (Score:3, Insightful)

      by damiam ( 409504 )
      Now that would be sweet - an XBox as an XTerminal. However, you probably don't want to have to look at everything on a TV, and it's cheaper to get an old Pentium computer with a network card.

      • Re:X term (Score:3, Funny)

        by Libor Vanek ( 248963 )
        BUT in combination with network card you can use this as:

        X server

        DVD 2 DivX grabber :-)

        Beowulf cluster of these for SETI ;-)

    • Re:X term (Score:3, Funny)

      by Henry Stern ( 30869 )
      Microsoft X-box: $299
      Linux: free
      Turning a lean, mean, gaming machine into a $20 x-terminal: priceless

      • Re:X term (Score:2, Funny)

        by samj ( 115984 )
        The USB has been hacked to prevent the use of standard PC devices. If this has been done well then it'll be very difficult to use Xboxes as X-terminals, but that almost certainly won't stop you from using them as cheap network servers. For example, even if we can't get other OS's running on it, we could just port apache and friends over - all they need is disk and network access. I think the future of the Xbox in non-gaming applications is looking fairly good. I'm definitely looking forward to building and MS sponsored rack full of Xboxes pumping out web pages for me :)

        Having said that it looks like the USB may not be that difficult to hack. I figure the boot process will be the next thing that needs attention.
    • Well, with all due respect, if you're going to drop $400 ($600 in Canada) on hardware for a remote X terminal, I'm sure you can do better than to support Microsoft in order to buy a game console, and then, instead of using it for its intended purpose, using it as a display.

      There should be some better options for dumb terminals out there, don't waste your money supporting MS to run OSS.

      --Dan
    • Bollocks to that, it'd make a brutal cheapo webserver.

      Dave
  • Look at it! the hard drive even has a red to one IDE cable for gosh sakes, its a PC that looks like a console, what a clever company though, get a pc, package it as a console and call it the most advanced console ever (altho they did ignore the diffirence between RISC and CISC chips)

    smart company, shitty product
    • Look at it! the hard drive even has a red to one IDE cable for gosh sakes, its a PC that looks like a console, what a clever company though, get a pc, package it as a console and call it the most advanced console ever (altho they did ignore the diffirence between RISC and CISC chips)

      It's a console because it has fixed specs. That makes all the difference in the world. Writing technology-pushing 3D games on the PC is hell, because even simple things can fail between different driver versions on the same card.
  • site's slashdotted - google cache dont have it.

    --insert joke about Icrontic running xbox here--
  • Possible? VERY MUCH SO. It's already been done to the PS2 [protista.com] for less than 20 bucks.

    This [easybuy2000.com] site has tons of system hacks.
  • K, is this site being Slashdotted already?? I can't get on.. bah!

  • Legal Action? (Score:1, Interesting)

    by r0ach ( 106945 )
    Yeah, Who wants to place a wager on wether or not Microsoft is going to try to take some legal action against the authors of that article for reverse engineering their proprietary hardware?

    • Re:Legal Action? (Score:4, Funny)

      by Jburkholder ( 28127 ) on Sunday November 18, 2001 @10:46PM (#2582877)
      "Xbox 8 of 42 in sector 47 Alpha reports an unauthorized modification attempt underway!"

      "Initiate counteraction response 1432 Delta!"

      "1432 Delta counteracation successful. Unauthorized technology modification attempt terminated."

      "We are the Borg. All attempts to modify our proprietary technology have been reversed. Your technological distinctiveness will be added to our own. Resistance is futile, have a nice day."
      • Borg, schmorg.

        That little play works better in Cylon voices.

        --Blair
        "By your command."
        • As I recall, the Cylon's only interest in humanity was to fly around and shoot at them (mostly exploding dramatically).

          No, no... there is something much more insidious about Borg's MO. Turning you into one of them while wiping out the one's they can't assimilate. *That* is evil.

          Cylons are just chome-plated target drones.

  • HardOCP have their review up (Score:5, Informative)

    by tacit ( 9329 ) on Sunday November 18, 2001 @10:21PM (#2582790)
    HardOCP [hardocp.com] have also ripped the guts outta the xbox, and their server seems to be a bit more responsive as well.

    Plus I trust the hardocp guys a bit more than the average "look maw!Ii'm on the interweb!" reviewer

    • Re:HardOCP have their review up (Score:4, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 18, 2001 @10:52PM (#2582894)
      The HardOCP review is really a much better article than this one. It really screams of "Hey look, I can take apart a box. Look at my ads!"

      The guy who posted the Icrontic article obviously doesn't know what he is doing. He mentions that he's surprised to find that there's nothing covering the power supply. It's a consumer electronics device; why exactly would there be a seperated power supply?

      It also claims the Conexant CX25871 Encoder is the DVD decoder, which is completely wrong. A quick Google Search [google.com] would show you that it is the HDTV/video encoder, which would explain its close proximity to the output headers.

      He also claims to be working on reading whatever is on Microsoft's proprietary filesystem. I really don't forsee any progress coming from an obviously half-assed website run by a bunch of teenagers.

  • Playstation Games? (Score:4, Funny)

    by Nathdot ( 465087 ) on Sunday November 18, 2001 @10:21PM (#2582791)
    So if the XBOX is just a PC what are the chances of hacking it so it can use bleem to play playstation (PSX) games.

    It'd be fun to see microsoft embroiled in a copyright dispute from the other side :)

  • GameCube Piracy now Available (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 18, 2001 @10:21PM (#2582793)
    In other console news, Hong Kong has hacked the gamecube into playing pirated games burned onto MINI-DVD or CD-R formats. They have developed a CD/DVD addon and use the Gamecube's expansion ports to implement it.

    Pretty quick if you ask me.
  • That's Funny.

    From the other Slashdot link to techtv [techtv.com] , the innards of the Xbox show a Seagate hard drive. This one, however is a WD. Different brands of HD in different Xboxes?

    I would think that kind of odd - wouldn't it be cheaper to just use one brand?
  • wow... speed is incredible. Dead or Alive 3 is REALLY smooth.


    I'll wait for the emulator. I figure if a PC is running it, it won't be hard to make MY PC run it :op The more people take it apart, the more I believe this to be true.

    • Regarding PC ports, I wouldn't be surprised to see an emulator come out pretty quickly. As long as Microsoft can build into Windows (maybe it's already in XP?) a way to enforce the copy-protection mechanism of the discs, they should have no problem with people without X-Boxes trying to buy and play games for their PC. It just means $100 Microsoft saves on X-Box hardware.

      The reasons against are support and development issues. That is, you can make a much cooler game much faster if you know exactly what hardware with what capabilities each user will have. That said, if someone goes out and makes a PC port, and it's recognized that all guaranteed-compatability bets are off (as was the case with Connectix's VGS), then it shouldn't be that hard to write it, and if it sells more X-Box games, then Microsoft probably wouldn't have a problem with it either.
      • I'll be laughing my ass off if it turns out that even with a hardware lockdown, XBox is programmed to DirectX and that provides portability back to (MS-running or emulating well) PCs.

        I agree, tho--the longtime advantage of consoles was their lack of variety--every console (of the same model) had the exact same hardware config, so you could (if you cared) program very unportable games that ran the hardware to its precise limits to give awesome performance. It also provided stability, as there wasn't that infinite permutation cluster of hardware conflicts and differences.

        As consoles get closer to stripped-down PCs, I wonder if this will change?
  • ...slashdot sure seems to have blown its collective load several times over since the XBox's release.

    - A.P.

    • Re:For a site that's so virulently anti-Microsoft. (Score:5, Interesting)

      by t0qer ( 230538 ) on Sunday November 18, 2001 @11:04PM (#2582938) Homepage Journal
      ...slashdot sure seems to have blown its collective load several times over since the XBox's release.

      And why not? I think MS is irrelevant to the fact that it is indeed a cheap alternative to the PC once we get the internal workings figured out. In these hard economic times, who wouldn't want a cheap PC?

      And what would make us blow our load harder (and Bill Gates top higher) than an article on /. saying that we've figured out how to get linux, a X11 server, and SDL ported onto the Xbox. It would be like shoving a million needles in microsoft's eye when it happens.

      Of course, there is the argument that we're just throwing money back into the devils pocket. Actually though, we're not. MS is taking about $100's loss per unit. With Linux running on it, it would give game developers an alternative to MS licensing on the XBox. You see, every game company that want's to make a game for any console system has to pay the console maker a royaltee on every game they make. So if we get the Xbox figured out, we could really start fucking with MS's head.

      One last reason to blow a load on the Xbox, it's just PC hardware, which I myself really understand well myself. Sure I could be taking apart a SunE250 server, but who has the money or the access to one? Even if you had access, my boss would certainly look at me strangely if I had a screwdriver near anything Non-PC in the enterprise class of hardware.

      Hope you enjoyed that, please aim your load away from me now.
      • Of course, there is the argument that we're just throwing money back into the devils pocket. Actually though, we're not. MS is taking about $100's loss per unit. With Linux running on it, it would give game developers an alternative to MS licensing on the XBox. You see, every game company that want's to make a game for any console system has to pay the console maker a royaltee on every game they make. So if we get the Xbox figured out, we could really start fucking with MS's head.
        First, not only are you throwing money back into the "devil"'s pocket, you're also creating publicity and support for it. I don't care if MS is taking a $100 loss, but imagine this. Their first console into the market beats out the PS2 and GameCube (incumbant console makers). Wouldn't that be the best thing in the world for them? Think about the advertising, consumer mindshare, etc. And who do you think would own the next generation then and control the next console and set prices accordingly? They certainly are not betting on sweeping out the console market by just using the X-Box. They would be stupid to think so, and much as a few people think, not everyone in MS is a dummy;. They're thinking in the long term when they can add more functions to X-Box 2, 3, 4, and they can control the living room, content side, and everything else.

        Second, do you honestly believe an established multimillion dollar game publisher is going to risk MS's wrath by publishing games that run on the X-Box but are unlicensed? Not to mention the legal ramifications if a publisher decides to skip on the royalties. Sure, I expect the X-Box to be hacked, and yes, we might get PC games to run on it and all of our other software, but I seriously doubt any of the big publishers (e.g. EA, THQ) has the balls to stand up to MS and release unlicensed games designed for the X-Box but not anywhere else and just release it as is. I'm sure that the publishers have some competent developers around that could reverse engineer the consoles, but there's a reason they just don't release unlicensed games.

        Anyway, just some thoughts. I'm not saying that MS's move into consoles is necesarily bad, but this is just a broader strategy to increase their goals of dominating new areas and increase their growth. I also personally do not believe MS has a chance against Sony, and from the looks of things, maybe not even GameCube. Their hardware does look very nice, but I don't know if they can hold out for the long haul without itching to build a new device too quickly.
        • The XBox uses a X86 chip (Cu'mine Celeron, ie a P3 core) & a NVidia unified memory multimedia/graphics I/O chipset.

          Right now Taiwan's motherboard makers are in the process of bringing out Athlon boards based on the EV6 bus version of NVidia's unified memory 'NForce' multimedia/graphics chipset [amdmb.com].

          That means that there will be X86 Linux chipset drivers for NVidia's unified memory multimedia/graphics chipset. & the next kernal revision will most probably have them pre-integrated.

          This means one should, with little work (once the HDD is re-partitioned/formated, so it no longer has MS's propietry XBos filesystem on it), be able to load a standard X86 distibution on it - such as the Madrake 8/1 gaming installation.

          Then any X86 Linux games should hopefully work.
          • That means that there will be X86 Linux chipset drivers for NVidia's unified memory multimedia/graphics chipset

            Truly interesting. What makes you say that? I'd love to see Linux and OpenGL running on the Xbox, it sounds like a great machine to run demos on, and I even think getting Linux on it is feasible. But the NVIDIA drivers? I doubt that, at least I won't hold by breath until it happens, I've kind of got used to life. NVIDIA doesn't seem to like the idea of documenting their hardware in an open way (old dogs don't learn new tricks, and that sounds specially valid in the case of ex-SGI engineers), and there's way too many people playing along (buying their stuff because there "are" Linux drivers), so the company doesn't even see the need to change its ways. Even if you assume you can use the already released stuff to drive the GPU, what about the nForce? NVIDIA has its own AGP drivers, they haven't released source for them, and they don't seem to plan on doing it. NVIDIA will probably gets a sizeable ammount of money out of Xbox sales, and they'll will do anything to increase sales by any ridiculous percent (even if that means providing Linux drivers for it), but daddy Microsoft won't like the idea, will he? That's a big but.

      • Of course, there is the argument that we're just throwing money back into the devils pocket. Actually though, we're not. MS is taking about $100's loss per unit.

        Keep in mind that I might buy this but...

        You do realize that if you DO NOT BUY it they'll have a MUCH GREATER loss per unit? Let's do the math. Buy one is -100 dollars for MS. Don't buy one is -400 (they cost 300 right?) for MS.

        Of course they'll get bought by somebody anyway, so buying it (with MS losing money) and then putting Linux on it is a lot more spit in MS's eye then just losing money... They have so much is just ridiculous. They could make money probably just from interest if they only charged a nominal fee for their software. (NB: Just a wild guess, I have no idea if that's true or not.)

    • It's the cheap hardware. (Score:5, Funny)

      by Technician ( 215283 ) on Sunday November 18, 2001 @11:54PM (#2583067)
      Slashdot loves hardware that somebody is helping pay for.. It includes everything from hackable bar code scanners (thanks Digital Convergance), pre programmed internet terminals (thanks I-Opener) and now hackable PC hardware (thanks Bill).
  • Could MS have made a mistake here? Basically, they are putting a (stipped down) PC into a console package. With the console selling less than WinXP (depending on, well a lot of stuff) what is to prevent everyone from re-tooling the Box into a cheap-ass PC? Not to hard even for novices at this point, I'd think.

    Perhaps more is not better this time?
    • Although I'm sure there are a few other obstacles, I think the biggest one is that MS has a proprietary (and IIRC, encrypted) file system on that HD, and according to the HardOCP article, the HDs can't be switched out for an off the shelf one. Also, i don't see how you could reformat that thing, as it certainly won't accept a boot floppy with a copy of fdisk on it.

      • Re:Microsoft Mistake? (Score:2, Insightful)

        by crispy ( 14415 )
        Similar obstacles have all been tackled by the TiVo hackers. It's very doable once you know the format of the fs.
      • That doesn't make much sense.

        Maybe it can't be made to boot from anything but the hard drive (or some ROM on the board) but the drive can, at the very least, be repartitioned on another system.

        The big hurdle will be getting it to boot the "wrong" OS. I'm sure it is rigged to check, and some sort of ROM update or hacked BIOS will be necessary.

        -Peter
    • Yes the components have been recyled, but no this is not a stripped down PC. It does not have a PC bios and the memory architecture is not modular in a PC way --- everything shares the same memory space for better game performance.

      It will be a few years before your regular PC can create frames as quick as this.
      • It will be a few years before your regular PC can do ten frames a second? o_O

        In both Halo and that Gotham Racing game, the reports I read said that framerates dropped to around 10 fps at some points.

  • One major difference (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Agarwaen The Tired ( 471456 ) <webmaster@aga[ ] ... t ['rwa' in gap]> on Sunday November 18, 2001 @10:50PM (#2582888) Homepage
    All consoles mainly differ from the pc by their Unified Memory Architecture. This basically means that all of the hardware shares the same memory so the latency between the various parts is nearly zero. Basically your graphics card and cpu use the same memory as your sound card. Xbox just takes the top of the line graphics card and eliminates the bottle-neck of pushing numbers to it. Don't kid your selves the first genaration titles look better then PS2 and weren't designed to truly take advantage of all the xbox can do. Later games will look MUCH better. Of course, the true secret is in the sauce. If the games aren't fun what does it matter how much better they look. It's why nintendo is still alive. They make good games.

    • Re:One major difference (Score:5, Informative)

      by CityZen ( 464761 ) on Sunday November 18, 2001 @11:03PM (#2582934) Homepage
      First off, the PS2 and GameCube don't use UMA. Both have embedded memories for framebuffer and textures. GameCube also has a separate audio memory (I don't know about PS2). For framebuffer and textures, UMA creates a big bottleneck. You have lots of high-bandwidth demands on memory, and only one memory to talk to. Having seperate framebuffer and texture memories reduces the bottleneck on main memory.

      Also, on the topic of latency, only the GameCube has truly low latency access to memory. Their "1T-SRAM" allows fast random access, low-latency memory access, whereas any system based upon DRAM only has low-latency for accesses within the same memory page. Page misses are relatively high latency.

      • Re:UMA is a performance issue (Score:4, Insightful)

        by X ( 1235 ) <x@xman.org> on Monday November 19, 2001 @03:00AM (#2583495) Homepage Journal
        Tradtionally, UMA is a huge performance issue because all the components are accessing memory over the same, narrow bus. However, Xbox uses AMD's HyperTransport bus, which effectively provides a dedicated channel for each device on the bus (in the Xbox's case I believe just the CPU and GPU are on the bus).
    • I have noticed a total lack in game quality compared to some of the classics. I mean, Civ II is /still/ fun. As are things like Tetris, Metroid, Duck Hunt... even Centipede. Today's games seem to rely on pretty graphics. But seriously, there hasn't been that much change in FPSs since Wolf3d (OK, 3d maps and jumping) that hasn't been in more powerful graphics engines.

      I just want to be back in a maze composed of many small, twisting passages, all different.
    • They've already release a EV6 bus (Athlon) version of their NForce unified memory graphics/multimedia i/o chipsets.

      This means that X86 Linux NForce chipset drivers are probably already out.

      Here's a preview of the referance board [amdmb.com]

      Here's a pic of the board [amdmb.com]

      PC unified memory chipsets in the past (SIS, VIA/Trident Blade, VIA/Savage, Intel 810/815), never really had the memory bandwidth for fast gaming graphics, but with a combination of twin bank & DDR its no longer a problem.

  • Ummm....Short memory, people? (Score:5, Informative)

    by PoiBoy ( 525770 ) <brian@poihold[ ]s.com ['ing' in gap]> on Sunday November 18, 2001 @11:16PM (#2582968) Homepage
    I've now read a total of 73 comments, the vast majority of which have talked about various hacks that people would like to see done. Sure, I agree, being able to hack this XBox into a $300 Linux box would be nice.

    BUT.........

    Just a few days ago there was another discussion at this fabulous web site about hacking the XBox, and several people pointed out that M$ uses various encription techniques in this machine which makes hacking incredibly difficult.

    Perhaps before people start spanking their monkeys for a second time thinking about hacking an XBox, they should recall the discussion following the first article.

    • Just a few days ago there was another discussion at this fabulous web site about hacking the XBox, and several people pointed out that M$ uses various encription techniques in this machine which makes hacking incredibly difficult.

      The harder, the better. It's more fun that way.

  • OK, put your mouse over the submitter's name (Keith). The link is to Icrontic.com. But that's also the site he points us to in his post.

    I wish the Slashdot editors would check to see that the story isn't just spam, promoting the poster's site.

  • "Watch this space" (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Legion303 ( 97901 )
    watch this space, because it won't be long until Xbox surgery is commonplace.

    I'm also keeping a close eye on the preferences page for an "XBox" section I can uncheck so I don't have to see these useless stories anymore.

    -Legion

  • Any EULA with the hardware? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by omega9 ( 138280 ) on Monday November 19, 2001 @12:43AM (#2583181)
    Any X-Box owners out there that can testify to the existance or absence of any sort of EULA for the hardware? Microsoft is somewhat famous for their software EULAs, would it be so supricing to find one on the X-Box?

    I've looked at the boxes they come in, but short of buying one I haven't been able to check out the included liturature. Perhaps one of you can stop gaming/hacking for a moment and actually read the paper waste that came with the box.

    Not that it will make a difference one way or the other. But you figure they have to know there's a hacker community out here just waiting to rip this thing apart. If not, I'm sure it will be a real i-opening experience!

    • I'm pretty sure the XBox is for sale at "regular" retail stores. There is no way that retail stores are going to go to the trouble of getting signed contracts from each person who buys an XBox. It would just be too much of a hassle, and they would have to refuse to sell the product to the most obvious market: minors. Therefore, regardless of whatever claims Microsoft (or pieces of paper inside the box) may make, there can't reasonably be any EULA for this product.

  • The buzz over the newsgroups about the two different hard drive sizes has been pretty intense the past few days (8 vs. 10 gigs). I'm not quite sure what kind of cost differential we're talking about at this point for two gigs, so you'd have a hard time saying some of the consoles should be cheaper.

    One interesting thing, though, is that it seems like all of the consoles have the standard "50,000 blocks" of memory to save games and music on the XBox. Where are the additional blocks for the 10 gig system? (Or less blocks for the 8 gig?)

  • Warning to those thinking of porting Linux... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by bani ( 467531 ) on Monday November 19, 2001 @01:15AM (#2583271)
    Microsoft will most certainly bust out the DMCA on you and have you arrested.

    You have been warned.

    M$ shareholders would most certainly demand prosecution under the DMCA. M$ will be forced to act.
    • To prosecute exactly WHAT?

      You own the fucking box. Hack it and you void your warranty. It's not licensed like software, you own the physical unit.

      Feel free to reverse engineer and hack to your heart's content. You don't break any copyrights by doing so.

      Hacking MS's proprietary encrypted FS is a different issue.
      • Here's how it would be argued:

        1) The xbox employs copyright control mechanisms which only allow specially protected/authorized/licensed software to run on it. This could be the BIOS, the encrypted FS, you name it. Almost anything can be an excuse.
        2) Hacking the xbox to allow "unprotected/unauthorized/unlicensed software" (eg Linux) to run on it implicitly requires circumvention of these "copyright control" mechanisms. This is prohibited by the DMCA.

        I also bet that the shrinkwrap license for xbox is written as a "rental" or similar, and that you really don't own the box or the software.

        • Hacking the xbox to allow "unprotected/unauthorized/unlicensed software" (eg Linux) to run on it implicitly requires circumvention of these "copyright control" mechanisms. This is prohibited by the DMCA.

          If and only if that Linux port somehow allowed users to gain access to copyrighted data (e.g. XBox games). If the CD/DVD driver just allowed normal access to normal media w/out automatically decrypting XBox games, then MS' lawyers would be hard-pressed to find a section of DMCA that applies.

          I'm not saying they wouldn't try it, and that they wouldn't be able to harrass and intimidate someone. But once it got to a judgement, Microsoft would face a serious risk of losing.

          I suspect that the safest thing for Microsoft to do, would be to buy a new law that protects give-away-the-razor-and-sell-blades business models.

  • 733 MHz Celeron? ATA33 cable (and drive I assume)? 10 GB drive? as a friend said, its an eMachines computer in a black box, sold by MS. :-P

  • Why hacking the XBox might not be worthwhile. (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    So I've been thinking about all this interest in hacking the XBox, and I've decided to take part in the fray. Bold statement: Hacking the XBox to do other stuff would be cool, mainly because it would earn one bragging rights, but it would be useless.

    The technology in the XBox is more expensive than a comparable PC. A $300 PC has much higher resolution video, more/expandable memory, standard expansion slots, a faster/larger HD, compatability with productivity software, and some even have TV output. The one thing that it doesn't necessarily have is the DVD-ROM.

    THAT'S IT.

    In the time it takes you to hack this device, the hardware gap will only increase. The only advantage to owning an XBox over a PC is in its entertainment value. Porting Linux to the XBox is an absolute joke. Since when has Linux been a platform for playing video games? Porting Windows would be far more interesting, but in all seriousness, Microsoft did that for you with DirectX (hence the X in the name XBox).

    Microsoft designed the XBox knowing that you're going to try, so if picking all the Microsoft protections satisfies your personal vendetta, go for it. You won't be able to market anything you come up with without a team of lawyers larger than Microsoft's, and if you're looking for render-farms, I hear that people waste CPU cycles all day long on the internet. If you convince a whole bunch of people to donate their unused CPU cycles, you benefit far faster than you do spending $300 a pop for a Box that's likely to be sold out at your local toy store for months.

    Don't listen to me. I just work here.
    -Mike
    • The flip side is that if you can figure out enough about the XBOX internals, you could potentially write an XBOX emulator, and all those great XBOX titles can run on your home PC :-)

      If they are using a relatively standard PC-style API, it might not be infeasible...the trick is probably figuring out what tweaks are in that nvidia gfx and sound chip.
  • Firstly, don't think your going to be able to put RedHat bootdisks in and fire it up.
    MS will have pretty good security here to stop this working (I know, Dreamcast's protection got hacked eventually, but we need a simpler way of doing this).
    What I suggest is the Trojan way in. We need to get a boot disc that has the capability of loading something like VMware/Bochs, and is certified by MS (The tricky bit). Once that is done, we're in. We use that as a bootloader, swap discs, and carry on as usual.
    Not the perfect solution, but it's a start to get a development system onto the machine.
    And it would show Linux running on a XBox onto a TV, this fact alone would be an achievement, no?
    So, who's up for a bit of social engineering into talking someone at MS to let us use a CDR with emulating boot code?
    As an aside, does anyone know if the XBox is region locked? I'm visiting the US tomorrow and would like to know if it's worth me bring a machine back to the UK. Ta!
  • It's the TV-Out chip.
    http://www.conexant.com/default.sph/SaServletEng in e.class/Web/products/products.jsp?Type=Prod&ProdFa mId=10&ProdCatId=0&ProdSubCatId=94&PartId=278&clrT rail=yes
    If it was doing the DVD playback it'd be marked 'Video Decoder'
    and I don't think Conexant actually makes an MPEG-2 decoder chip.
    HardOCP made the same mistake... Hmm...
    • Well duh...

      There actually is no reason why DVD decoding should be done in hardware. The specs of the x-box make it suitable enough to do DVD decoding in software easily. Maybe the video decoding hardware is for TV output or input. Maybe one could convert the X-box into some tivo-like appliance?

      If digital video playback is done in software (I'm talking MPEG here folks), it might be possible to get this thing to decode DiVX ;-) or other digital video formats as well.

      Or am I too far off base here?

  • I have some maps for UT that are 4mg is size alone. Surely they jest with us.

    I'm surprised they did not put in a 40gb drive. It about where the lower end price/size break is. (eg cost per meg)

    By my estimates its about 40gb on the low end and 80gb on the high end. Any bigger or smaller than that, and you start paying through the nose for little extra bang.

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For God's sake, stop researching for a while and begin to think!

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