The Future of Love and Sex - Robots 510
nem75 writes "The New York Times has a review of British AI researcher David Levy's book 'Love and Sex with Robots'. He claims that within a span of about 50 years the day will come when people could actually fall in love with life-like robots. While this may seem far fetched at first, he has some pretty interesting views. 'He begins with what scientists know about why humans fall in love with other humans. There are 10 factors, he writes, including mystery, reciprocal liking, and readiness to enter a relationship. Why can't these factors apply to robots, too?' The case he builds goes much further though, and certainly provides food for thought." Update: 12/14 16:16 GMT by Z : This article is very similar to a discussion we had recently.
Robots are fine... (Score:5, Funny)
=Smidge=
Re:Robots are fine... (Score:4, Funny)
From Agnes - With Love (Score:2, Funny)
"Advice to all future male scientists: be sure you understand the opposite sex, especially if you intend being a computer expert. Otherwise, you may find yourself, like poor Elwood, defeated by a jealous machine, a most dangerous sort of female, whose victims are forever banished--to...
the Twilight Zone."
http://www.tv.com/the-twilight-zone/from-agnes---with-love/episode/12725/summary.html [tv.com]
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I mean, if they can come up with a realistic robot, that looks like the ideal chick to any guy, will never age or get old looking (nothing sags), won't give you AIDS or any other STD, will NEVER say no, and give you the custom 'ride of your life' every time you 'mount up'........
No man in the world would ever give the time of day to a real woman ever again.
Re:From Agnes - With Love (Score:5, Funny)
That's ok, their robot goes all night long and never leaves the toilet seat up.
Re:From Agnes - With Love (Score:5, Insightful)
The upshot is that it is possible to replicate the object of a man's sexual desires much more easily than the object of a woman's sexual desires, since a man's sexual desires are almost entirely physical. For a replicated male robot to be uber-sexy, it would have to be smart, funny, suave, and have high social status, wealth and power. Obviously, that may all be possible one day but we can all agree that that day is much, much farther off. In the meantime, the asymmetry is going to create a real problem for women.
One caveat: this assumes that sexbots for men will become available sooner than perfect virtual reality. Once we have VR a la the Matrix, robots as sex-replacements will be moot anyway.
Re:From Agnes - With Love (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:From Agnes - With Love (Score:4, Interesting)
Maybe men and women have different reproductive strategies for entirely biological reasons -- though, given the increase in female promiscuity since the invention of birth control, the "entirely" part of that is pretty suspect -- and maybe it's all social conditioning. We don't know, and speculation from your pet pseudoscience doesn't really help.
Re:From Agnes - With Love (Score:5, Insightful)
Well let me be the first to present it in this manner.
01) No PMS
02) No hormonal imbalances
03) No maxxed out credit cards
04) No cars driven til the motor burns up due to lack of oil
05) No bitching when your with your male friends at a sports/whatever event.
06) No lies
07) No drugs
08) No veneral disease
09) No coming home to an empty house, bank account, garage, investment accounts
10) perfect food, sex, massage, and SILENCE when ever you want it.
Young men tend to believe in love, older men become jaded, and ACQUIRE
the above list of 10 things as I have.
4 decades of harsh reality tends to fill in the above list.
Here is to hoping you retain your innocent unjaded view for your entire life.
~Adios~
Re:From Agnes - With Love (Score:4, Informative)
Re:From Agnes - With Love (Score:4, Insightful)
By 45, many women like sex a lot and are RISKY as hell to give your heart to. Let's face it, a woman can go 4 hours a day (more) if she enjoys it.
Many other women dislike sex and you are looking at suffering in a sexless relationship or begging for it.
Remember - 2 to 3% of children do NOT match the paternity of the father.
And the legal system is setup all goofy so that another perfectly capable human being can have sex with you for 2 to 3 years and then take half of everything you own along with your heart.
If you are a man of *any* means, unless you win the love lotto in your 20's, it is more fun, safer emotionally and financially to date/rent women by implying you are interested in commitment and shedding them off when they get too pushy. There are millions of (decent looking, kind) women who are way too easily attracted by a fairly tiny amount of money (like 2,400 to 4,800 bucks a year on gifts and stuff) and 4-5 hours of listening to their problems-- including a lot who are in relationships with other guys.
And maintaining a solid relationship takes a good 30 hours a week-- if you can't hack that many hours, then have fun- get a girlfriend instead, party and do fun things. You'll always be pushing women away so many will be trying to land you.
I think men and women are really not wired to stick together more than 7 to 10 years. I've read some articles implying women lose commitment when the kids are a bout 5-7 years old-- the possible reason being that at that age they could walk and forage their own food so a man isn't needed as much.
Don't Date Robots! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Don't Date Robots! (Score:5, Funny)
10 factors to fall in love? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:10 factors to fall in love? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:10 factors to fall in love? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:10 factors to fall in love? (Score:5, Funny)
You just deny the ACK, Jack
Kill the PS Fan, Stan
Use the "no battery" ploy, Roy
Electricity ain't free
Just short out the bus, Gus
Don't need to discuss Mussss
Just decrypt the key, Lee
And getcho self free...
Re:10 factors to fall in love? (Score:5, Funny)
The problem is inside your CPU it said to me
The solution is quite easy if you take it logically
I'd like to help you make the move to version 3
There must be 110010 ways to leave your robot lover
It said that it was waterproof and inter-cooled
Furthermore, it stated it had cruise control and auto-lube
But I was most impressed with the self-inflating boobs
There must be 110010 ways to leave your robot lover
110010 ways to leave your robot lover
CHORUS:
You just deny the ACK, Jack
Kill the PS Fan, Stan
Use the "no battery" ploy, Roy
Electricity ain't free
Just short out the bus, Gus
Don't need to discuss MUX
Just decrypt the key, Lee
And getcho self free...
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The 11th factor (Score:5, Interesting)
Because they are not robots.
Re:The 11th factor (Score:5, Funny)
Re:The 11th factor (Score:5, Funny)
Re:The 11th factor (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:The 11th factor (Score:5, Informative)
Good (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Good (Score:4, Funny)
Shallow (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Shallow (Score:5, Funny)
Falling in love in 50 years? (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Falling in love in 50 years? (Score:5, Interesting)
As for the Real Doll, my guess is that women will respond with ever more drastic measures to look attractive (just as women respond that way to air-brushed magazine pictures of women that don't represent how even those models look cf. Dove). Now, if robots can be more emotionally responsive than men, will men do something drastic to compete with robots?
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Shit. We're done for.
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Pleasing women in that way is not (as far as we know) a matter of following simple rules.
Re:Falling in love in 50 years? (Score:5, Insightful)
1. Our egos are too big to even recognize the competition. Men see the good-looking men in the magazines every bit as much as women see the good-looking women. But do we go to the same efforts to emulate? "I'm perfect the way I am. Any woman would be lucky to have me. My ego told me so." Most men have no clue how to dress or groom themselves, myself included.
2. Women tend to claim to want more "emotionally responsive" men, but my real-world observation tends to contradict that claim. Perhaps someone's done an actual scientific study, but I have not noticed men who are in touch with their feminine side having much luck in the meat-marketplace. Cliches such as "Nice guys finish last", and "Women prefer assholes" tend to support that theory.
My point here is that the necessity of competing with robots for "emotional responsiveness" is probably overstated (assuming a suitably emo robot could be designed), because what women claim to prefer, and what women actually prefer (based on their choices in men) tend to be vastly different.
3. I think many men would tend to be satisfied with a physical relationship with a robot, to the point of preferring that over the head-games provided by most women. This is especially true because there would be no such thing as a robot that is "out of your league". If you could be nailing a convincing, if robotic supermodel, would you prefer an average-looking emotionally-unstable human female over that smokin' hot robot?
You may choose to dismiss point #3, but look at the success of prostitutes. A quick perusal of craigslist.org confirms that there are a nontrivial supply of men out there who are happy to pay a few hundred bucks for a 1-hour tryst with a woman they know would never speak to them absent the donation to her college fund.
I think where I come out on this is that women will face more competition from robots than men will face from them. I am not in the field of robotics, but my software experience tells me that it is probably easier to engineer a convincing sex toy than a convincing "emotionally responsive" companion. And that's assuming that anyone has figured out what type of "emotional responsiveness" women truly desire (rather than claim to desire).
Re:Falling in love in 50 years? (Score:5, Interesting)
You are correct that "emotionally responsive" is an imprecise term. It's kind of like "genetically fit". What's "genetically fit"? Well, whatever *turns out* to work at passing on genes. You can't know it in advance. Likewise, "emotionally responsive" doesn't necessarily mean wussy -- it means more like, "acting with knowledge of what women will really like, irrespective of claimed desires".
I would absolutely agree with you that what women claim to want and what they really want are far apart -- more than 42 trillion km. It's rather frustrating to see them espouse feminist notions of how men should act, and then boink the first guy who violates them all. The theory that "Women give flawed advice to cull the guys who actually listen to it from the dating pool" fits the data a bit too well. Look at the Spice Girls song: "If you want to be my lover, you gotta first be my friend". What expert seducer doesn't find that advice abhorrently wrong?
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Regarding 2: I think you may like this post of mine.
I'd say that post is pretty spot-on accurate.
I think that we agree that what they do NOT want, is for a man to spew out all kinds of emotional baggage. The more I think about it, "emotionally responsive" is probably pretty close to what women want, in the sense of responding to her emotions. For instance, when a woman is PMSsey, the typical male response is to start nailing her sister or best friend. Most women would prefer, I think, for a man to toss her a bottle of Motrin say they hope she feels bette
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I don't know about you, but I'm going to peacefully coexist with robots. I'll drink beer and play video games all day, and not get blamed for a thing!
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We already have people who are falling in love with their Real Dolls. There's a documentary
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I'm not going to search the web for 'Real Doll', because I'm at work. So I'll ask here:
What is a Real Doll?
A "lifelike" sex doll. realdoll.com
Why do you know about it?
Because he's been on the Internet for more than a couple of weeks, probably. Real Dolls were a popular subject on the Internet some years ago, and are still frequently referenced.
Where can I get one?
realdoll.com, but it will cost you. You have to be really dedicated to self love to drop the kind of money they're asking on what is essentially a masturbatory aid.
The Lonely (Score:4, Interesting)
Sounds like a sci-fi book. (Score:2)
Here's a review. (Score:2)
Or a sci-fi movie (Score:2)
This is not unprecedented. (Score:4, Insightful)
I had a huge crush on Ryoko from the Tenchi Muyo animes. This crush didn't even require the physical contact that would be present with a robotic hottie. There is little room for doubt that our emotionally sticky limbic system can latch onto unusual objects of affection - I believe it's not unusual to be loved by anyone...or to love anything.
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Why not? (Score:4, Insightful)
Why can't these factors apply to lamps, too? (Score:5, Funny)
I see where this is going... (Score:5, Funny)
Deamon Seed (Score:2, Interesting)
Anyone remember "Deamon Seed" or the more recent Battle Star Galatica.
Can you rape a robot?
Can a robot rape you?
Rather a Holodeck! (Score:2, Funny)
(That and I already have the sign made to hang over the door that reads:
Scott's Holodeck of Whores: Enter At Own Risque)
jurisdiction to legalize marriages with robots (Score:2)
Who needs robots? (Score:2)
It doesn't even require a life-like robot for a nerd to fall in love with.. Usually a bit of pixels on the screen, resembling some attractive women having sex with men do just fine $)
Silly question. (Score:5, Funny)
well, that's got to be the stupidest question I've ever read. OF COURSE WE DO.
Only on Slashdot (Score:4, Funny)
Only on slashdot would someone consider having sex with a robot as a relationship.
Emotionally Stunted (Score:5, Insightful)
It is totally okay with me if this guy wants to fuck animatronics, but he doesn't do himself a service by confusing that with love.
-Peter
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Love = sacrifice? Love = emotional exposure? Love = risk of loss?
We can definitely satisfy those three criteria with a machine.
Sacrifice: I had to wait in line to get my Nintendo WII.
Emotional exposure: I tell my Nintendo WII that I love it and
Re:Emotionally Stunted (Score:5, Funny)
1st law of robotics addenum (Score:5, Funny)
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Besides, where sex is involved I try to avoid the word "clap". "My robot gave me nanites!"
Feeling loved (Score:5, Insightful)
It is easy to love someone or something.
It is harder to feel loved.
And harder still to feel loved by something you know does not think or feel.
For that reason, humans will continue to feel loved (or not loved) by other humans more easily than they can connect with inanimate objects.
Re:Feeling loved (Score:5, Informative)
However, the type of people who typically believe they feel "love" for a fictional character/doll/piece of machinery may find it easier to trust them. I think the majority of these people have social issues, maybe including social anxiety or paranoia. A relationship with something that won't judge them is appealing to them.
I recently watched a documentary about people who own Real Dolls. They personify their dolls as if they are actual people; holding conversations, hanging out with, getting "intimate" with them, Most of these men explained that they're simply unappealing to women, and while they'd prefer the company of an actual person, the doll is better than nothing to them. One of the men did describe how he'd been abandoned and treated in ways that drove him to the dolls, and claims he prefers the dolls because he can't trust a human. He also claimed to love several of his possessions (car, guns, sword).
I guess my point is that this cascading logic for love isn't universal, though I'd agree it applies to the majority. Some people will fall in love with an inanimate object MUCH faster than they would with a human being.
People's need for electrifying sex (Score:2)
People often overlook things they care about when there is no risk they won't get it. Look at the dating sites. People make a list of what they like, then they date people who match. Then they realize what they should have listed.
Then again, in an overpopulated society, I definitely would not want to encourage more people to be breeders, and I see lot of good in this notion, even if I think it won't solve all the problems people have. Overcoming people's basic animal and getting more in control of exp
I am not looking forward to... (Score:2)
50 years? Try 50 minutes (Score:5, Funny)
Re:50 years? Try 50 minutes (Score:4, Funny)
eww.
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Oddly appropriate... (Score:2)
Robots falling in love with you? (Score:2)
The Future of L[awsuits] and Sex (Score:2)
The future is now. The future is bunk. (Score:2)
Thoughts on David Levy (Score:5, Insightful)
Do Androids dream of electric sheep? (Score:3, Funny)
Great. New images stuck in my head.
Life emulates Star Trek. Again (Score:3, Informative)
Often overlooked (Score:5, Insightful)
I hate to introduce a serious note, but there's people out there who could benefit from a little bot-love. People who are disabled, deformed and badly disfigured have traditionally had a lot of trouble finding partners.
Masturbation and prostitutes are often their only access to sex. Love is something for other people. A mechanical counterfeit might be more acceptable than the alternative.
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Well, not on purpose at least, right?
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Damn those Replicants!!!
Re:Grrr (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, there are people that are having sex with inanimate dolls (real dolls plug here), It would not be far fetched that someone would be amenable to the idea and even build a business out of having sex with robots. There are more advantages than using the regular purveyors. It's more sanitary, there are more control on the looks of the service provider and you only have to perform maintenance every so often.
I think that "love" is too much of a word for it. Infatuated or having "a crush" would be more appropriate. It's going to be something carnal and not with meaning. It would take a long time for us humans to develop enough intelligence in robots for us to have a "meaningful relationship" with them.
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The thing is, that we already have the technology to make sex robots happen... I bet a machine given
Re:Grrr (Score:5, Funny)
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Seriously, I'm not going to have sex with a robot. Get over it!
Uh, yeah, slashdot and all these articles and books and research are all aimed at YOU specifically. Thanks for telling us you're not interested, now everybody focusing on this can give it up and go do something else. Right, come on, get real - whether you will use them or not, it's pretty obvious that sex robots are going to be huge someday, millions of people will be using them, and robot technologies probably won't be going backward as time
Re:Grrr (Score:5, Interesting)
A vibrator IS a robot. It may be a simple one, but a robot none the less. The trick will be to see if they can get men to buy into robot sex as much as women have already embraced it.
As for love... Given how many people cannot tell the difference between a human and a dog, I have no doubt that getting people confused between an even semi-realistic looking android and a human would be easy and common.
Re:Grrr (Score:5, Funny)
Look I was drunk, alright?! And the dog came on to me first!
Re:Grrr (Score:5, Interesting)
This is one of those odd areas where men are the ones who are behind, as far as social acceptability of a sexual practice goes.
Vibrators are talked about and alluded to in a largely positive light in TV and movies all the time. Generally, at least for a couple generations now, the idea of a woman with a vibrator has been a turn on, or at least not a turn off. Women have Mary Kay-esque sex toy parties.
How many references to sex toys/masturbation aids for men are there in popular culture, compared with those for women? Far, far fewer, I would bet. What percentage are positive? Barely more than 0%, I'm sure. Being a guy and having any items of that sort is seen as something to be embarrassed about. Hell, I'm a guy, and I'm aware of the double-standard, and the idea still kind of weirds me out.
Socialization is a powerful thing.
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But loving of pets is illegal in most places, no matter what you see on those websites.
Re:Futurama Said it best (Score:5, Funny)
PUNCHLINE! (Score:3, Funny)
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People aren't taught how to think.
Re:Futurama Said it best-SAY THE REST (Score:3, Funny)
And Bolts!
(P.S. a couple of my favorite Internet authors, Elf Sternberg and DB_Story, have been writing about these types of relationships for years now.)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
And Asimov wrote about this in at least two stories... one about a housewife who falls for a male humaniform robot that her husband brings home from work (name escaping me at the moment) and I think "The Bicentennial Man" also included some robot lust (there my memory of the story is failing me [probably due to having seen the awful Robin Williams movie]).
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one generation left for humanity... (Score:3, Interesting)