Slashdot Log In
OLPC Project Interface Revealed
Posted by
Zonk
on Fri Nov 24, 2006 11:16 AM
from the warm-edge dept.
from the warm-edge dept.
BogusToo writes to mention an EE Times article describing the interface for the OLPC project laptop. Using some fairly intuitive UI concepts (like simplified web browsers and a chat client), the Linux-based system attempts to do away with the kludgey parts of computer use. A video demo of the interface has been placed on YouTube. From the article: "Earlier postings around the Internet have also shown how the physical design of the laptop has changed, including the elimination of the much touted on-board hand crank that was supposed to power the cheap, lime green laptop. It's still there, reportedly, but has now been moved to the power adapter. The OLPC's produced earlier this week in Shanghai still need to go through loads of testing, such as knocking them off desks and dropping them in mud, as kids are wont to do. They may also be kicked around, like soccer balls, a popular sport in 99.9 percent of the world."
Related Stories
[+]
OLPC's UI To Be Kid-Tested In February 140 comments
dfoulger writes "The AP is reporting that kid testing of Negroponte's '$100 Laptop' starts in February. This article is some of the first mainstream coverage of just how different the user interface of the XO Computer is — it ditches the traditional office metaphors in favor of a 'neighborhood' and an activity-based journaling approach. Video of Sugar, as the UI is called, has been out on the net for a while, and Popular Science recently gave the color / monochrome display a 'Grand Award' in its 2006 technology roundup. What do you think of this new UI?"
[+]
Novel OS Drives the '$100 laptop' 174 comments
jrwr00 writes with a link to a CNN story about the $100 laptop's unique operating system. We've discussed the OLPC's UI before but the article offers a few new piece of information on the project, which is expected to roll out this year. From the article: "The XO machines are still being tweaked, and [OLPC UI] Sugar isn't expected to be tested by any kids until February. By July or so, several million are expected to reach Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay, Nigeria, Libya, Pakistan, Thailand and the Palestinian territory. Negroponte said three more African countries might sign on in the next two weeks. The Inter-American Development Bank is trying to get the laptops to multiple Central American countries."
This discussion has been archived.
No new comments can be posted.
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
Full
Abbreviated
Hidden
Loading... please wait.
Durable Laptop? (Score:5, Interesting)
Having worked for a school, I know how durable these devices are going to have to be to withstand day-to-day use. The Compaq, Toshiba and NEC laptops of 10 years ago didn't take much more than a nudge to the back of the LCD to crack it or break the backlight, leaving the (admittedly rich) parents to fork out another $3,000 for a replacement unit, or $1,200 for the out-of-warranty repair.
I hope that these computers end up being not just "cheap" but inexpensive to own, operate and repair. Insurance premiums on cars go up if the cost of parts/repair is high; the perceived value of this device changes in inverse proportion to this - why would a school/state/country buy thousands of them if the spare parts/repair cost is going to be high?
Here's hoping it's right when it comes out ...
Re:Durable Laptop? (Score:5, Insightful)
My problem with the OLPC is related to the whole low power/low spec business. I keep hearing about how important it is to save memory, CPU and power on the machine. And yet... the GTK widget set that it uses has gotten slower and slower with every release since GTK 2.6.
The GTK developers simply have no idea what they are doing. They ditched all the old X code and moved to Cairo which massively increased the RAM and CPU requirements for GTK apps... particularly hurting phone/PDA users like Nokia google for it... it's all there on the web). On top of the Cairo problems, they also made changes that sabotaged the performance of the various widgets. Basically, every version of GTK past 2.6 has been a fucking performance trainwreck, and the developers responsible (people like Owen Taylor) have just snuck off quietly and not taken responsiblity.
I remember the GNOME mailing list discussions about adopting the then forthcoming GTK 2.8 -- adopting it meant taking a risk on GTK getting it RIGHT since they would be reliant on untested code. Lots of credulous developers said that they should adopt it because they had faith in the GTK developers not screwing them over. Mugs.
Half a dozen versions later, and GTK still sucks fucking balls... and what's more, the OLPC suffers from it even worse because it is a low-performance system. Essentially... it runs like shit because of the GTK developers never having heard of stuff like optimization and benchmarking.
Parent
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
gimme a terminal! (Score:5, Insightful)
One thing I was wondering while watching the video is that it seems there is no way to open a terminal. I agree that the interface MUST be dumbed down a lot but I am also completely sure that there MUST be a terminal in order to access more "complex" things in the computer. I know (from personal experience) that the kids are the first ones to learn the new technologies and exploit them. If you are going to give them this computer, then lets make them able to get the most out of it.
A terminal and a python enabled system would be enough (IMHO).
Parent
Re:gimme a terminal! (Score:4, Interesting)
Why? My 4 year old granddaughter seems to be pretty capable of cruising around limited parts of the house PC. Her aunts, uncle, and mom seemed to be pretty capable of doing the same when they were that age. Kids are not dumb. They will quickly learn whatever interface you put in front of them.
Seeing as how the big box stores are selling standard laptops for $400 and under (somtimes a LOT under) this week...when you consider the vast difference in purchasing power...the "OLPC" concept is mostly already here in the west. It's just not backed by a fancy organization.
Parent
Re:gimme a terminal! (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't agree it must be dumbed down - I started programming on a VIC-20 where almost anything remotely interesting required lots of PEEK/POKE. I was 5 at the time, and didn't know a word of English. By the time I was 7 we got a C64, and I could program it better than my dad (who wrote programs for it as part of work) within months. I was an exception among my friends, but even the ones that didn't take up programming had no problems picking up whatever they needed to do what they wanted to with the machine.
It's adults without computer experience that needs dumbed down interfaces, not children. All you need is some examples they can copy and modify to get them started.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Indentation-wise, my current C code (and my C code from 10 years ago) looks no different from my Python code.
Most people I know who complain about Python's use of indentation stop complaining once they realize that it doesn't apply to line continuations within open parens, brackets, etc.
Re:gimme a terminal! (Score:4, Funny)
If you don't indent your code (whatever the language), I hope it never makes it onto one of these laptops. Or any of my computers, for that matter.
Parent
Re:gimme a terminal! (Score:4, Informative)
There is a terminal activity. It does not, by default, have a frame icon (bottom left row of icons). It is opened with a key combination.
A terminal and a python enabled system would be enough (IMHO).
Which is also included An activity's UI, Sugar itself, etc, is all written in Python and is the 'blessed language' for development on the OLPC. Backend code (Abiword, Gecko) are obviously not Python, though.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Fools give kids a new laptop that costs > $500.00US And yes I am calling many rich people fools.
You can try it yourself (Score:5, Informative)
Intructions are here [laptop.org]. It uses QEMU and a special 100Mb system image.
Happy slashdotting...
Mod up "Informative." (Score:2)
Thanks pieleric!
Here, I'll get these out of the way . . . (Score:4, Funny)
There. Did I miss any?
Now you can talk about the contents of the article rather than blather about the same stuff that comes up every time the One Laptop Per Child project gets discussed.
Re: (Score:2)
Not much, just every other OLPC discussion plus the comments above and below yours that explain that this IS NOT AIMED AT COUNTRIES WHERE PEOPLE ARE HUNGRY. Check the fucking buyer list for christ's sake. I swear,
Re: (Score:2)
You can't just type in a location? (Score:5, Insightful)
"Note that there is no url bar" (in the browser)
I really hope there's more to it than that. I mean, I realize that google isn't going anywhere anytime soon, but having any single search engine be the mandatory primary interface for the web, to the exclusion of even being able to type in urls directly seems insane to me.
<marge>Hrmmm....</marge>
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Nice try, though.
P.S. it's unbelievably cool in person.
Weirdos (Score:2)
If you thought curling [usacurl.org] was a strange sport, get ready for laptop soccer!
All the kids are doing it, well 99.9% of them at least!
New UI - why?? (Score:4, Informative)
* For lower resources still, use the excellent IceWM. But if we already have firefox, then we've already loaded GTK, and may as well use Gnome. Anyonw who wants a demonstration of how fast simpler programs can be, please try Dillo.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:New UI - why?? - Agreed. (Score:5, Insightful)
Speaking of which, the word processor is using a picture of a floppy disc to represent saving a file. Since a)The OLPC doesnt have a floppy disc and b)The target users may never have seen a floppy disc, they may need a new icon...
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Misread (Score:2)
Including minesweeper is tasteless (Score:3, Funny)
I tried running the Linux image last night (Score:2)
I only spent 20 minutes running the image, but one thing that I did not notice was region-specific documentation for water cleanliness training, etc. I thought that these would be customized for each country/region. Does anyone know about this?
I was telling a lot of non-nerd friends about this project at a big Thanksgiving party yesterday, and not only did everyone really like
Worse than ms bob? (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
The main targer for these are places like Brazil, and India... where basic human services are in-place.
Re:This is ridiculous. (Score:4, Informative)
Parent
You are right (Score:2)
You want to help the people, get on it.
Bear in mind, that all the countries are paying for these.
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
Re:OLPC BS (Score:4, Insightful)
While you are correct in part also consider the old saying: give a man a fish and feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and he will feed himself for the rest of his life.
If people are dying in a village because they have no food they need food first but after that what? Do you expected a never ending trail of planes dropping food forever? The unit could be used to help educate the village into doing what's right for themselves. By teaching better practices to the ignorant we can hope that they become self sufficient. Education is the foundation of a solid society.
It's not like they're shipping these things out with Counter Strike installed. These machines could become a keystone in fighting bullshit like illiteracy. They can learn the dangers of certain water sources and make better decisions on what crops grow best under conditions that these people can directly interact with.
A lot of the third world's problems would become vapor with a bit of the education that you and I take for granted.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
In the end even if we only get these communities to the point where they become self-sufficient and not integrated into the over all culture of the wor
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Look at the list of deployment. These are not horribly poor countries. They have electrical infestructure, access to medical care in many cases, food, clothing, and domestic products they sell. What they lack is a wel
Re: (Score:3)
The OLPC is for people who already have access to food, water, shelter and so forth. There are plenty of other initiatives to provide more basic needs. Support those if you want to, but don't knock this project. It's got the potential to do great
Re:Why is the GUI non-standard? (Score:5, Insightful)
Why is the GUI non-standard?
Because all the existing GUIs in the world today --- including System 6 --- are overweight, overcomplicated, way more powerful than are needed, fiddly, baroque, inconsistent, difficult to use, difficult to learn, and in fact are downright scary to people who aren't accustomed to computers.
KDE, Gnome, Windows, OSX, etc are all completely inappropriate for a machine of this nature.
(In fact, I still think they have a lot of work to do. The relationship between activities isn't particularly clear. Some applications, such as the word processor, still use popup menus, which is very bad. Etoys --- that's Squeak, isn't it? --- is visually inconsistent with the rest of the system. But at least they're heading in the right direction.)
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Ohh and
Re: (Score:2)
On the other hand, you could have used FreeDOS. I'm not sure about the WP, though. Hell, at least he wasn't used to WordStar.
Charles
Re: (Score:2)
Ohh and why not just put in a Dos with wp 5.1? Well do you still have the install discs lying around?
Caldera OpenDOS is available for free --- if you hunt around a bit --- and works pretty well. You may also want to give FreeDOS a try, it's probably decent enough to run WordPerfect.
Alternatively, you could give him one of the OLPC LiveCDs and see how he gets on with that!
Re: (Score:2)
I was blown-up. One million childs growing with Squeak. *That* would be a good idea.
Unfortunately, I loathe Squeak. Smalltalk is very cool, but Squeak have managed to wrap one of the greatest programming languages ever with a user interface designed by anally-retentive O/C monkeys. Admittedly, in this context the fact that it behaves like nothing else on earth isn't an issue, but Morphic still requires far too many weird CTRL+SHIFT+right mouse click+drag combinations to do simple things like moving windo
Re: (Score:2)
Questionable GUI (Score:3, Interesting)
That said, you really need to do ethnographic field research in order to develop a proper GUI. Considering that we still fight with antiquated counterintuitive 1970's UI conventions in the first world, despite being bombarded with technology, I can all but guarantee our conventions are not
Re: (Score:2)
Why? The price? Considering that BestBuy was selling (limited quantitise) of standard Toshiba Satellites for $250 today, factor in the vast difference in annual imcone/purchasing power, and you're already there.
What's holding you back?
Re: (Score:2)
Ever heard of a "loss leader"?
Try to buy a few million of these laptops at $250.00 each and I think you'll discover that it's not possible.
You'll also be stuck with a Windows virus magnet(tm) that will make the machine unusable within days (minutes) of connection to the Internet. Plus you won't get all of the educational software bundled with the machine and you won't get the mesh networking (probably for the better if you're using Windows) and you wo
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
While the low price is a plus for me, I'd personally buy one of the OLPC laptops for durability and power consumption reasons. This laptop is designed to withstand some pretty serious abuse. The $250 laptops from Best Buy aren't nearly as hardened. This laptop actually has to have a decent battery life. The cheapo ones from Best Buy do not.
In fact, the only other "hardened" notebooks I can think of are high-end Thinkpads and Panasonic Toughbooks. I challenge you to find me one of those for $250.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Tom
Re:Kick it around like a ball? (Score:5, Funny)
A lady brought in her favorite keyboard, wanted it repaired. Did not want a replacement, as she only liked that keyboard. The keyboard's problems were two fold:
a: Her daughter had taken it out back and used it for a rousing pickup game of baseball (as the bat)
b: her daughter had found the cord to be a nuicance and cut it off with a pair of scissors.
I've had SEVERAL machines come in with the VGA connector pulled off the motherboard when people try to detach the screwed on cable without unscrewing it first.
I had a business owner carefully disassemble his hard drive and bring in the platers in a zip lock baggie because we told him if he brought in his harddrive we might be able to recover the data (the drive had not been dead, just generating a lot of errors when he replaced it.) He needed the data on the drive for a tax audit begining at 8am the next morning.
I often talk to people who can't get something to work primarily because it isn't plugged in. For example, no dialtone on the modem because there is no phone line hooked to the computer. No video signal because the monitor is not hooked up to anything (there are no cables coming off of the monitor at all... heard that more than once... that's because you didn't hook the cables too the monitor that came with it).
Printers regularly get sprayed with WD-40.
A customer took a wireless router from us and wanted to mount it on the wall, so he drilled two holes through the middle of the router and screwed it to the wall. Then expected a refund when it didn't work. Another tech tells me a tale of someone drilling a hole through their LCD display to mount it on the wall, but I'm not sure I believe that.
We had a laptop back there last week which had several muddy boot prints on both top and bottom, and numerous dings where it obviously got tossed around. According to the bringer, it's their son's laptop and he just brings it in from college, tosses it on the floor, and regularly walks on it.
We had a customer that bought several of those 'small' Dell computers (business machines that are small tower/desktop units... bookshelf style I think they are called) in a row. They were the cheapest thing dell was selling in the line, and came with about a 60 day warranty. The all died in less than 6 months. The customer was putting the Pentium 4 computers in a desk drawer and then piling papers on top of them. I've also had a customer use their computer to block a heating vent in the winter because they didn't like the warm air blowing directly upon them.
I've had people cut the wires on their fans because they didn't like the noise (or even better, jam them with a stick).
Someone whittled down the power connector to plug in a new hard drive because it didn't fit (had it upside down) and killed the drive.
A supposed A+ certied tech brought us 5 machines he was building. He had tried to hammer the processors into their sockets (he hadn't pulled the lever up).
And finally, I worked on an Amiga 500 once that had no keyboard... just the membrane pad underneath it with letters marked on it with a sharpie. Upon opening it there were about 500 22 gauge wires inside. Why? because the owner had physically picked the machine up and thrown it across the room where it hit the doorframe, destroyed the keyboard and physically broke the motherboard in half. I was just adding memory to it, at the time (a year or two after the breakage) it was actually working.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)