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Solar Wi-Fi To Bring Net to Developing Countries
Posted by
CowboyNeal
on Thu Aug 03, 2006 07:51 PM
from the let-the-sun-shine-in dept.
from the let-the-sun-shine-in dept.
JLavezzo writes "TreeHugger.com has an article today on a new wifi development organization: MIT and the UN have teamed up to provide kids living in the world's least developed nations $100 laptops, their 2 watts of juice provided by hand or foot crank. Cool, but - and this was one of Bill Gates' criticisms - what's a computer without internet access? Enter Green Wi-Fi, a non-profit that seeks to provide 'last mile internet access with nothing more than a single broadband internet connection, rooftops and the sun.' Their wi-fi access nodes, which consist of a small solar panel, a heavy-duty battery, and a router, can be linked together to extend one internet connection into a larger network. The two guys who started the company - Bruce Baikie and Marc Pomerleau - happen to be veterans of Sun Microsystems. Deployment is set to start in India at the end of this summer."
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Think of the possibilities! (Score:5, Funny)
the flies will come through the tubes! (Score:5, Funny)
Not exactly. The number of flies in each location will stabilize, as the flies travel through the series of tubes that make up the internet. Don't get me wrong: the internet is not a truck. So don't even think that it is.
Parent
Re:Think of the possibilities! (Score:5, Interesting)
I know you think you're being darkly humourous (or maybe just fasionably cynical - it's hard to tell), but there's a bit of truth in what you say.
I work on a project whose aim is very directly pointed at improving communications so that people in rural areas can actually find out just how bad things are in the capital. One of the biggest problems we face here in terms of political reform is the fact that there's absolutely no follow-up, no accountability for elected officials. They buy votes with a few pots and pans and bags of rice, then disappear for four years. But if their villagers actually knew just how much money they were making (and wasting on their cronies), there would be hell to pay.
So if someone with family in the city were to receive news (including, for example, photos of the MP in his fancy new car), it would be a lot harder for him to lie to them the next time around.
It's not a complete solution, by any means. We only need to look at the state of politics in our own so-called developed countries for evidence. But it's a good start, and a vast improvement on the utter lack of communications capacity that most places in the world have to deal with today.
Parent
Re:Think of the possibilities! (Score:5, Interesting)
In the village where he teaches, a year or two back they got hold of a single mobile phone.
There's no electricity in the village. Nor is there mobile-phone coverage. Nevertheless, it has paid for itself a thousand times over.
It goes like this.
They grow and sell various farm-products. They sell most of their stuff on a market 4 hours walk away. It's possible to recharge the mobile-phone at the market. There's a spot with mobile-phone coverage half an hours walk from the village.
End effect ? The villagers know the prices at the market, what is in high demand and what has oversupply so the prices are low. This enables them to make more intelligent choices about what to bring to the market at which times.
End effect ? The market is better supplied. They are better paid.
Knowledge is power.
Parent
Re:I was thinking the same thing (Score:5, Insightful)
Both. Now quit offering these simplistic and narrow-minded false alternatives.
Did it ever occur to you that in order to deliver aid, people might need communications capability? Or that the vast majority of people are not dying of being poor, they're living with it. This means that if they're going to improve their lot - and everyone on the face of this earth has that right - they might need access to information in order to do so?
Parent
Re:I was thinking the same thing (Score:3, Insightful)
Chapter 1: Aids
a. You get Aids from having sex with someone who has AIDS.
b. You can't cure aids by having sex with a baby.
Chapter 2: etc.
Might be worth something
Re:I was thinking the same thing (Score:2)
In countries where the entire economy and government has failed, education is a much more important charity than food or medicine.
Re:I was thinking the same thing (Score:5, Insightful)
How do you propose the family of four get medical care for a year be distributed (and used by the proper recipients)?
You have control of the resources before it reaches TPTB (The Powers That Be). Once it's there, however, all bets are off.
Here's an example:
You see people panhandling for money. Offer to take them in the nearest restaurant. Give management enough money...with the understanding it can only be used for the person in question and anything left over goes in the tip jar. The person you're helping is polite (if you're lucky) but refuses.
Does this mean:
1) They aren't hungry and anticipate having enough the next time he's hungy?
2) you've determined the reason they need the money is to buy some MD2020 (it's a wine -- Mad Dog 20/20 - you're better off to drink battery acid. I cannot imagine a hangover on it. Find some at a cheap-o liquor store try a little, and pitch it - it's an experiment -- not unlike a deep-friend twinkie or Snickers bar at a state fair. I buy whatever is new that year for a one-bite taste by tearing it off, passing the rest off to anyone else wanting a taste. If you are clueless about these deep-fried foods, consider yourself fortunate) or some other booze (or drug)?
3) they need the money for something else - something positive? e.g., sick kid to the clinic?
4) they really rake in the $$$ asking for money and have no reason to find a job.
5) sitting there kills time vs. sitting in the library and doing nothing.
6) ???
You've got the money in hand. How do you decide how it's distributed and how much to give them? (I have a personal pattern|policy, but we won't worry about that right now)
If you hand over the the funds, you have a good chance of believing it will be diverted. That's when the Time photo of Bono means squat. "Forgive the countries which can't pay their debts. It's crippling them trying to keep up." (read that: we're loan sharks) We clear the slate, they have nothing. We give them money, it goes the same place all of the other money has gone. Bono goes oh-fer by asking us to wipe the debts again. Fortunately, none of his money was diverted and he can continue to wear kool-yellow glasses.
If we give them "clean water, a secure food supply, basic medicine, reasonable security...for a year", how do you prevent the hard goods from being sold to another group|country for $$$ or exchanged in some other fashion? Reasonable security? Right now, we're in a bad spot right now [1] -- although we have now have an exit policy [2] and have to intervene in how many other companies using a fleet of UN black helicopters? If it's a UN and not US issue, there's plenty of representation from the countries who are robbing their people blind and have already diverted all of the funds. I hear a One World Order being proposed by someone coming in from the side door.
Lots of fine wishes, but it's not going to happen in the real world. Anyone for a video game? World Conquest & Domination? Wait. Something near to that was in Never Say Never Again.
__________________
[1] A man goes to hell and is greeted by Satan who explains the rules: "I'm going to walk you through a long hallway of rooms. You'll be able to look inside and determine if you want to stay there for eternity [or not]. If you choose to pass but find everything after it is worse, you cannot return. Again, once you pass, you cannot return." They go to the first room and all of the surfaces are so hot people are doing everything they can to avoid contact - jumping off of the floor, wall, taking turns standing on each other, etc. "I'll pass. There's no way I could handle that for eternity." "Fine. But you cannot return if everything else is worse." They go to room #2. Everything must be very cold because the vapor from everyone's breath can be seen in the air and everyone
Parent
Re:Think of the possibilities! (Score:2)
Re:Think of the possibilities! (Score:3, Funny)
P.S. I, and only I, can tell you which Church is the right one, but you'll have to sign up for my newsletter first, before I deem you worthy of such knowledge.
Sounds good, but... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Sounds good, but... (Score:2)
It doesn't have to be an all or nothing thing.
Re:Sounds good, but... (Score:2)
Re:Sounds good, but... (Score:2)
It's a Sunny day (Score:2, Interesting)
Didn't someone on the top of Googles command chain come from Sun ?
Sun may produce some seemingly "bloated" stuff, but they damn sure produce some fine people also.
Re:It's a Sunny day (Score:2)
Justice at last!!! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Justice at last!!! (Score:3, Funny)
have they been to tthe 'least developed nations'? (Score:4, Informative)
They dont even have shoes. These people's most valuable posessions are sticks. I'm not kidding. Sticks are fuel for cookfires. They walk all day with a hundred pound of sticks on their back, with no shoes, no roads.
Now, these people cant read either. Can you not see how pretentious it is to expect them to value a laptop with WiFi when they are starving and can't read?
Get them some shoes first. That will help them a lot more.
Re:have they been to tthe 'least developed nations (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:have they been to tthe 'least developed nations (Score:2, Insightful)
One of the great tragedies of poor countries is that a little knowledge could help them make much better use of their limited resources. If I couldn't afford a pair of shoes, I'd google for information about making some... if I had access to the Net.
Re:have they been to tthe 'least developed nations (Score:2)
In traditional societies, crafts such as shoemaking are taught to apprentices willing to dedicate several years to the task.
Your shortcut assumes, in rough order:
That the man without shoes is in good health, with no relevant physical or mental disabilites.
That he has the free time to master a skilled trade. That he is computer-literate.
That the craft can be mastered without hands-on instru
Re:have they been to tthe 'least developed nations (Score:4, Insightful)
Parent
Re:have they been to tthe 'least developed nations (Score:2)
Solar Cooking (Score:4, Informative)
Parent
We need this here, too. (Score:5, Interesting)
~Rebecca
Re:We need this here, too. (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:We need this here, too. (Score:2)
(The word "solar" describes so many types of energy, referring specifically to photovoltaic panels helps avoid confusion with things like solar heat. Really, all biomass fuels, including petroleum, started as solar, and
Open Source it, Green Wifi !!! just like Ronja! (Score:3, Insightful)
Going for a cure; not treating the sympton (Score:5, Insightful)
The rich nations of the world could divert massive portions of their GDP to feed the impoverished world. Even if you could political find the will to do this, it would solve nothing. Poverty is a symptom of a much larger problem. The core of the problem lies in education. If they can be educated, they can save themselves. Hence, things like cheap Wi-fi while certainly is not a silver bullet, it at least begins to pick away at the problem.
Education is the key. With education and access to information other problems can start be solved. Good democratic governance absolutely demands an education population that is able to vote outside of tribal ties. Educated leaders are need to tackle both social and economic problems, and not just in government, but in business as well. The core of a functional democratic government is an educated population. We can feed the impoverished nations of the world from now until the end of time, but until educated leaders step up they will remain impoverished.
So yes to those that will surely complain about this "waste" of money, these people need food and clean water. Food and water is not the cure though. Education, information, a fiscal boost once good governance is in place are the solution. Throwing money at the worlds poor just to feed them is like pumping blood into a man with a severed artery; the problem isn't that he is running out of blood, the problem is that he has a severed artery.
No learning, no bread. No bread, no learning. (Score:2)
Keeping people from starving in the several ongoing world disasters is not something we should abandon but that has nothing to do with why portable laptops and networks are good for "developing" nations.
The simple justification for these projects is that it's cheaper education. Dead tree based information is expensive and fragile. Think of the tons of material required for every village to have even a rudimentary library. One leaky roof or arson can take it all away. Now realize how easily that libr
Re:Going for a cure; not treating the sympton (Score:5, Insightful)
Also, I consider the whole "good governance" mantra a cop-out. Yes, there are many corrupt countries to point to. But even the countries with good leadership are hamstrung by payments on old debts and irrational demands by the IMF. Too often, the cycle goes like this: the old regime is thrown out, replaced by someone who wants to make life better for a country. But to do that, they need money, because a government without money is just a bunch of people sitting around wearing poofy wigs. The IMF offers them a loan, which they really can't afford to pass up. But in order to get the loan, the IMF demands that they do things that will lead them to the Holy Grail of Economic Development: capital investment. The measures for attracting investment are simple, yet cruel: balance their budgets, privatize state-run institutions, and remove any restrictions on the flow of goods and capital into their country.
Balancing the budget means cutting back on expensive programs that provide for the poor, the elderly, and the unemployed. Liberalized trade means that while people get cheaper goods, the gain comes at the cost of jobs, as the market wrings out the "inefficient" producers. Liberalized capital controls means that investment money pours into the country when times are good (causing inflation), and flees at the first sign of trouble. The newly privatized industries have meanwhile fallen into the hands of foreign investors, who frankly don't care if the industries are serving the needs of the country, so long as they're delivering 22% a year.
The people look at the massive unemployment and the piecemeal sale of their country to foreigners, and they don't see good governance. Quite the opposite. So they throw the bums out, and the IMF just shakes its head and mutters about how sad it is that so many countries have such a shortage of good leadership.
Compare those outcomes with the Asian economies, which are growing rapidly while steadfastly ignoring the IMF's advice and rejecting their loans.
Parent
Re:Going for a cure; not treating the sympton (Score:4, Insightful)
I think that this might just work along those lines as well.
Parent
Hindenberg (Score:4, Interesting)
As someone involved in a wi-fi WISP (Score:4, Insightful)
I was talking to someone who has also deployed wi-fi just the other day. His honest opinion of his equipment was that the companies selling wi-fi seem to be more interested in selling a lot of equipment than they were in spending the time to develop solid equipment that actually worked and worked solidly.
Of course, I smell MESH networks, and nothing sounds cooler than a wireless MESH network...but in my experience, there is also a lot hype there that also falls flat when you actually try and deploy it.
Of course, some of our problems have resulted in some crappy boards we were sold, but even if they were working 100%, I'm still less than impressed with wi-fi on a large scale like that.
Transporter_ii
Wifi is the wrong tool for the job. (Score:5, Interesting)
What's interesting is that the Ricochet [wikispaces.com] network has already been designed, deployed, proven, mismarketed, and abandoned. Metricom's routing protocol was vastly superior to anything else in this space, and now YDI's got the patents locked up.
Airespace was founded by a bunch of ex-Metricom brains, and it looks like they built many of the same smarts into the same [cisco.com] casing [wikispaces.com]. Then Airespace got bought by Cisco and they call it the 1500. I wouldn't mind playing with a few dozen of these.
Anyway, if someone could convince YDI to open the intellectual property, that warehouse full of Ricochet poletops could be deployed anywhere in the world. The modems are cheap, the hardware is bulletproof, and did I mention they go a mile on the stock rubber ducks?
Parent
Most WISPs are run by dummies. (Score:3, Informative)
OT: Tech stuff is all well and good... (Score:5, Insightful)
Rule of law and basic economic freedom seem to provide the best means out of poverty, every time it is implemented, and roads might help that effort along.
I know building the Interstate Highway system in the USA seems to have done wonders in a country that was doing well anyhow, but how about it? Aren't roads high tech enough to be sexy?
After all, how do you deliver X (medicine, water purifiers, food, laptops and WiFi set-ups) without roads?
On the other hand, the cynical side of me thinks... if you put solar powered anything that might have any other use... it will get stolen.
Maybe you really do need "rule of law" first.
Re:OT: Tech stuff is all well and good... (Score:2)
Not if they're aren't any roads for the thief to get away
Sorry... forgot to suggest Mr. Gates's Money (Score:2)
And by "roads", I do mean literally roads, but also any other infrastructure that we westerners might overlook as "obvious". How about some more phone lines, etc.
Maybe assasinate a few warlords on the sly, while you are at it. You know, basic stuff.
Re:Sorry... forgot to suggest Mr. Gates's Money (Score:3, Interesting)
You're absolutely right about basic infrastructure. Transport and communications are integral to a viable economy. This, by the way, is exactly why we need tools like solar powered wireless - to
Re:OT: Tech stuff is all well and good... (Score:2)
The bottom line is that there's no simple bottom line. It takes a constant cycle of capital and education in order to grow an economy. You're more than welcome to debate how the capital should be spent and how the education should be accomplished, but it's useless to debate which should come first.
As a
But India isn't doing OLPC! (Score:2)
Free WiFi and Diamonds and Water in the Desert (Score:3, Interesting)
An illterate family is dying of hunger somewhere in a Africa. Someone offers them a loaf of bread to melt down their free solar powered wi-fi station and latop as scrap metal. They gladly trade.
That's the problem in these places where people are starving and illiterate. Any kind of infrastructure you put in is just going to be sold as scrap for food. This might not be the case in India, where people aren't starving to death and are not totally uneducated, but this kind of thing has happened over and over again in Africa. People put in an elaborate desert irrigation system to grow food and all the pipe fittings are stolen and sold as scrap metal.
Re:Free WiFi and Diamonds and Water in the Desert (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Free WiFi and Diamonds and Water in the Desert (Score:2)
steve
Re:Free WiFi and Diamonds and Water in the Desert (Score:3, Insightful)
Satellite (Score:2)
Ever heard of Satellite Broadband [fcc.gov]? It's not as fast as fiber optic cabling but it works in remote areas.
Re:So (Score:4, Insightful)
So, I tend to like seeing these "brick-and-mortar"--and workable--solutions actually come to market.
Parent
Re:So (Score:2)