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Michigan Teen Creates Fusion Device
Posted by
ScuttleMonkey
on Tue Nov 21, 2006 02:28 AM
from the fire-in-the-hole dept.
from the fire-in-the-hole dept.
Josh Lindenmuth writes "The Detroit Free Press is reporting that Thiago Olson, a 17 year old Michigan teen, was able to create a small fusion device in his parents' basement. The machine uses a 40,000 volt charge and deuterium gas to create the small reaction, which he says looks like a 'small intense ball of energy.' The teen's fusion device is obviously not a self-sustaining reactor, but it still shows how fusion technology is becoming more accessible. Hopefully this points to a future where large scale fusion reactors are both economical and widely used."
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What's up with Michigan? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:What's up with Michigan? (Score:5, Funny)
Deuterium, apparently.
Parent
Re:What's up with Michigan? (Score:5, Funny)
> Deuterium, apparently.
*whoa* Heavy.
Parent
Becoming? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Becoming? (Score:5, Funny)
What, did the professor travel back in time 1050 years in order to plant a research seed?
Farnsworth: "Good news, everybody! Today we go on a one-way trip back through TIME to stimulate the development of nuclear fusion!"
Everybody: *sigh*
Bender: "Do they have money in the past?"
Farnsworth: "Yes. And they carelessly transport it in pockets, wallets, and purses."
Bender: "I'm in." [burps and roars fire out of his mouth]
Leela: "But professor, won't we be stuck in the past, only to live out the rest of our lives in the gruesomely primitive twentieth century?"
Farnsworth: "Well, there is definitely a very slim chance that someone in the twentieth century will invent the electrostatic fusion device needed to power my Time ReturnoWhatsit to send us back home. Perhaps one of the local nerds will invent one in his parents' basement."
Fry: "Yeah right. When I was in the twentieth century, I spent all of *my* time drinking beer, watching TV, and trying to pick up chicks."
Amy: "That's *still* what you do here in the *thirtieth* century."
Fry: "Oh yeah."
Bender: "We're boned."
Parent
Site is down, so no videos for now (Score:3, Interesting)
Can anyone independently verify that fusion is actually occurring here? Is he really creating Helium in the chamber?
Re:Site is down, so no videos for now (Score:5, Informative)
Deuterium-Tritium fusion spits out a neutron at a well know enegery level (14ish MeV), and a helium. With the appropriate gear either the proton or the neutron are easy to spot/measure.
Parent
either that (Score:5, Funny)
Either that, or it points to a future where large scale fusion reactors are widely used in parents' basements.
He initially wanted to create a hyperbolic chamber (Score:4, Funny)
The hyperbolic chamber (Score:3, Funny)
Definition of hyperbolic
exaggerated: enlarged beyond truth or reasonableness; "had an exaggerated (or inflated) opinion of himself"; "a hyperbolic style"
Neutrons (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Neutrons (Score:5, Informative)
According to the wikipedia article [wikipedia.org], "neutron emissions can present a hazard if voltages above 40 kilovolts are used". Sounds like the kid was cutting it fairly close, but should have been reasonably safe. It sounds as though the associated X-ray emissions are actually more problematic.
Parent
How do we know it's fusion? (Score:5, Interesting)
And what is a "hyperbolic chamber"???????
Note: creating a plasma at 17 years old in a garage would still be very cool. Maybe not slashdot-front-page cool, but still cool.
Re:How do we know it's fusion? (Score:5, Funny)
He didn't do it in a garage, though - he created plasma in his parents' basement, which makes it more relevant to Slashdot readers.
Parent
Fusor (Score:4, Interesting)
so really nothing new.
Future of Fusion (Score:4, Insightful)
I'm sorry... but while this teenagers work is certainly commendable and nothing to sneeze at (in fact, Large engineering firms such as Siemens [siemens.de] seem to take an interest in him). His work does nothing to further research in the field. Non-sustaining fusion reactors have been around for decades, and its been widely known how to build one for at least 20 years. For most people, the cost is the limiting factor. Why would you want to spend $50k-100k on something that uses more energy than it produces?
Now when we finally get a sustainable fusion reaction that produces more energy that it uses, that would be something to write about!
Yahma
ProxyStorm [proxystorm.com] - An apache based anonymous proxy service.
Fusion is no big deal! (Score:4, Informative)
So if fusion is so easy, and if it's such a great power source, why aren't we using it right now to generate power? The Fusor device can easily make fusion happen but, for various reasons, it is not energy-positive fusion. The energy you get out of it cannot be capture in a useful way to get more energy than was put into it. So they're great for neutrons but not much else.
If someone could figure out a design that would be energy-positive then we would have something amazing but there's nothing there for that right now.
Really? Me too! (Score:4, Funny)
I love bylines! (Score:5, Funny)
Like GINA DAMRON, the reporter who doesn't listen, and can not know the difference between a "Hyperbaric Chamber" and a [sic] Hyperbolic Chamber, which sounds oddly shaped, but unremarkable.
Good on you Gina, keep up that keen reporting.
I'm looking forward to your report on the Frictional Distillation process.
Re:I love bylines! (Score:4, Funny)
Are you kidding? I made a Hyperbolic Chamber, and it's the greatest thing ever! Its better than a baseball player batting TWO thousand!! No one has ever even imagined anything as phenomenally revolutionary as my Hyperbolic Chamber!!! I can guarantee that my Hperbolic Chamber will solve world hunger and instantiate world peace!!!! It's as hot as the center of the sun, and as cool as intergalactic space!!!!!
Parent
Points for technical ability, but... (Score:5, Interesting)
Technical skill? Yes. Advanced knowledge? Yes.
But primarily, ability to follow directions available everywhere [wikipedia.org]? Yes.
He may very well be a genius, but it is as likely that he's a genius at self-promotion as anything. There are many high-quality science projects he could have done, but add the words "nuclear" and "fusion" and you attract a lot of media attention. He'll make a good string theorist...
JD
Kick ass (Score:5, Interesting)
Newsorthy? Not necessarily, but that's no reason to make it seem like what he's done is without merit.
Re:Been done before (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re:Been done before (Score:5, Interesting)
Making a fusion reactor [brian-mcdermott.com] is relatively easy, albeit somewhat dangerous, like you said.
From here [brian-mcdermott.com]:
As with any nuclear-related project, safety must be taken into consideration.
[...]
* Radiation; this should be the least of your worries until about 15,000 volts of acceleration potential. At this point, x-rays start to emanate from viewports due to electron and ion bombardment of metals in the chamber. Always use a camera or mirror to peer into the viewport. X-rays can cause burns and lead to cancer. Above 40,000 volts, x-rays will start to come through the stainless steel chamber walls. At this point, you will need to use lead shielding. Neutron radiation is the most dangerous form of radiation known to man, but the fusor does not put out enough of it to be dangerous until about 45,000 volts. It can easily be shielded with water, wax or plastic. You can also minimize your exposure by standing well away from the fusor, or by operating it for only 20 minutes per week.
More safety info [kronjaeger.com].
Really, it's that pesky part where we try to actually make it produce energy and break even that is stumping us right now.
Parent
Re:Been done before (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:Been done before (Score:5, Insightful)
this is the statement of an asshole. Why make an almost asinine comment like this?... a 17 year old applied himself in a very unsual way that shows intelligence, aptitude, application, and determination. Researched, developed and built a remarkable machine. Sure, it's been demonstrated since the 20's, but you probably read about it in a book at best. Or looked up on wikipedia that it was first done in the 20's.
Most people just read about things. Others do things. Knowing things and not doing is borderline redundant. Hearing of something being done for a long time and never even remotely applying yourself even within 1%, and then criticising and reducing the absolutely remarkable efforts of others is borderline criminal. Get a life, but more importantly, get some perspective.
I'd love to see a picture of your fusion machine, or anything even remotely demonstrating the independent application of intelligence. People that make these kinds of comments rarely partake in anything of the kind.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
http://www.airgas.com/browse/product_list.aspx?ca
Re:Deuterium? (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:Deuterium? (Score:5, Informative)
Its a non hazard material, non radiative, and WAY to common for any kind of sale restriction to make any sense.
Isotopic purification is dead easy if the weight ratio is 2:1, vs for example 235:239...
Parent
Hydrogen, yes; Deuterium, no. (Score:5, Informative)
IIRC, commercial heavy water plants do something that takes advantage of the slight difference in boiling point between D2O and H2O, and do a very delicate fractional distillation, over and over and over. The energy involved to do it is pretty immense, and it would be tough to do except under very carefully controlled conditions. Hydrogen sulfide may also be involved at some point in the process, as well, at least according to this WP article [wikipedia.org].
Parent
You are joking, aren't you? (Score:4, Insightful)
Alternatively, he might have bought a small quantity from a scientific supplier. Even the Government is going to realise, especially if his teachers wrote in, that the size of fusion bomb you can build with a couple of grammes of heavy water and the tritium from a beta light is less of a threat to the US than one NRA member with a hangover and a grudge against his ex-wife.
Parent
Re:You are joking, aren't you? (Score:5, Funny)
That's just low. Most NRA members are responsible adults who just want the right to bear arms and protect themselves and their families. They're not crazy gun-toting lunatics with hair-trigger rifles and bad tempers.
Hahaha, just kidding, yes they are.Parent
OT: NRA (Score:5, Informative)
I remember when I was in Boy Scouts during the 1970's and I took the dreaded "Rifle and Shotgun" merit badge.
Back then, the NRA was a gun safety and training organization. They struck everyone as being straight-forward and calm, more interested in making sure that people knew how to prevent gun accidents and how to responsibly own firearms.
Then things changed, and they transformed themselves into a political organization - and now they're either seen as "the safeguard of the American way" or "crazy gun-toting fascists," depending on whose overheated rhetoric was heard last.
Perhaps this should be seen as a warning to other groups - once you enter the political fray, you become a political animal. Or in the words of the Punisher, "The means always screws up the ends."
Parent
Re:OT: NRA (Score:4, Insightful)
Relatively speaking, they still aren't.
Every time someone makes a point that the NRA is extreme, I like to point out that to many gun owners the NRA is a bunch of pussies. Compare them to The Second Amendment Foundation or Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership. (I'm at work, so filtering prevents me from visiting their sites to gather URLs.) By that measure, the NRA is the voice of reason.
Personally, I take a middle tack. The NRA is the only gun rights organization big enough to make a difference on a national scale, so I support them. However, they have majorly screwed up in more ways than I can count. First, there's PR. Back in the day (until the late 1980s) the NRA was the national governing body for international shooting sports. That meant that the road to the Olympics went through the NRA. The people that worked that program weren't political animals and they failed to defend their turf; the NRA gave up NGB status and let is slide over to U.S. Shooting. That was the single stupidest PR mistake I've ever seen. Almost no one can argue against gun ownership for the purpose of winning Olympic medals, yet the NRA can no longer use that as an example. Way back in the day, it was possible for an NRA rep to hold up a S&W M52 target pistol and say "This is the pistol that Ruby Fox used to win a silver at the L.A. Olympics. We are the organization that provided the infrastructure for that to happen. The assault rifle bill before Congress would ban this gun, thus proving that gun control is a bad thing." (Yes, the original Matzenbaum assault rifle bill, the grandaddy of all that sort of legislation, would have outlawed as "assault rifles" nearly all semiautomatic pistols and shotguns as well as rifles.) The NRA can no longer stand up and say they represent potential Olympians. I'm still shocked that they don't seem to realize what a powerful PR tool they lost when they gave up sanctioning authority.
Another PR error? Here's one, drawn from your own post. You say the NRA has changed. It hasn't. The NRA is still a competition, safety, conservation, and training outfit. All the political stuff belongs to the NRA's Institute for Legislative Action. But does the general public realize that the organization that teaches Boy Scouts and the organization that lobbies Congress are two different things? Not really. The NRA has failed to differentiate, thus contaminating their functions that nearly anyone would agree are wholesome with the stench of their political activities. That's bad PR and I see no way to correct it.
Second, they have wussed out at any number of innopportune times. Check the website of any "NRA watchdog" and you'll find instances when they backed down instead of going for the jugular, usually in the name of preserving future relationships. The earliest I can remember was the so-called "cop killer" bullets, a fiction dreamed up by anti-gun types that the NRA caved on. Now, the notion that there are teflon-coated pistol bullets out there that magically slide through bulletproof vests (and that those objects only exist because the NRA wants them to exist) is ingrained in the minds of most people who don't know any better. It's just crazy. Just this last week, in that Law & Order episode where the escaped con kills all the little schoolgirls, there was an obviously dubbed line thrown in about the bad guy having obtained a .45 with "teflon bullets." Argh! That kind of willful ignorance makes me crazy; if the NRA had done a better job back when they had the chance, such ignorance wouldn't be so common.
Third, they've simply failed far too many times. How in the bloody hell did the machine gun ban get passed? I've seen the video of the voice vote. It wasn't even close to passage, yet the Speaker simply pronounced it p
Parent
Re:Deuterium? (Score:5, Insightful)
Two liquids that close in vapor pressure are very difficult to separate (and requires expensive distillation equipment according to the wiki). As for the grandparent - electrolysis would work because the strength of the HO and DO bonds are different though according to the wiki this is not efficient either. But the principle is the same - unlike for larger isotopes which chemically are essentially identical (and require centrifuges to separate by density), hydrogen isotopes have different chemical properties that can be exploited in rates of reactions and one of these is given in the wikipedia for those interested.
BTW as isotopes go it is very cheap to just buy heavy water (probably because it is relatively easy to obtain) and that is probably the source for this guy's experiment.
Parent
Re:What colour is energy? (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:What colour is energy? (Score:5, Funny)
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THIS IS AN OLD FARNSWORTH FUSOR! (Score:5, Informative)
This is a Farnsworth Fusor. See Wikipedia at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusor/ [wikipedia.org] for info on this type of device, which is VERY OLD, reasonably well-characterized, and most definitely NOT an energy-generation device.
Fusors use far more power than they generate. The idea is a pair of spherical grids charged to 50K volts differential. Deuterium gas is a welding supply item. Gas hits the outer grid, ionizes, and is propelled at ultra-high speed to the exact center of the grid.
The drawback is the inefficiencies: There is no known design (and some theoretical work saying it is impossible to a achieve such a design) which does not have significant heat losses to impacts of the gas on the inner grid. This generates random gas, which impedes the movement of the ions, etc.
It is also known as Electrostatic fusion.
Parent
Neutron source (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:What colour is energy? (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
MY DEATH RAY! (Score:4, Funny)
Stupid coach."
Parent
Capacitors (Score:5, Informative)
See, a real battery can only push so much energy out per second (I think batteries are usually defined in milliamp hours (mAh)). So what you do is you start pushing charge (electrons) onto a capacitor, and then when you need a real big quick burst of energy (like, say, to shoot an electron at a TV screen) the cap can give you that high amount of current or voltage very quickly.
Another use is to smooth power signals. You're getting sent AC voltage in the wall, which oscillates above and below zero volts. This gets rectified at the home so that it's either above or at 0 volts. Then, this gets filtered through a series of capacitors (and lots of other stuff, too; Zener diodes FTW) to provide (more) consistent voltage, instead of a rising and falling voltage. In essence, it's acting as a battery for us while the voltage is lower than what the circuit needs.
Capacitors are also very important in analog filters and a lot of other Electrical Engineering voodoo.
Parent
Re:Capacitors (Score:5, Funny)
There is no such thing as a "safe" capacitor! They are filled with SMOKE and that smoke is DEADLY. ALWAYS let the smoke out of the capacitors before attempting to handle them! This should only be done by PROFESSIONALS. Do NOT try this at home.
Always assume a CAPACITOR is holding a charge. And: Capacitors don't kill people, it's the circuit of which the person is a part that is dangerous...
Parent
Too easily frightened. (Score:4, Insightful)
Parent
Re:frightening (Score:5, Insightful)
What's really sad is that people are so frightened, that they would willingly give up personal freedoms and stifle overly creative children for some ill-perception of national security.
Parent
Re:frightening (Score:4, Interesting)
The people who are afraid of overly performing students (there are a lot of them actually) are not the police, or national security or any such people but :
1) the teachers (most are a) quite dumb b) don't like to be challenged when they screw up a theory c) don't really know the subject)
2) fellow students (we've all watched the "nerd" movies)
Parent
Re:frightening (Score:4, Insightful)
Your comment is symptomatic of a larger problem in society. We're scared of our own shadows. "Oooooh the evil scary nukular stuff is in the hands of the teens! Run for your life!!!" - Is this even slightly rational? He can't hurt anyone with electrostatic confined fusion (if you could weaponize that, the powers that be would have done so already). If he fries himself with X-rays or high voltage, then that's a risk he took for himself; his parents may have a say in what risks he exposes himself to, but it's not my concern or yours.
Personally, I'm far more worried about what a government will do when given powerful toys than I am about what a lone teenager will.
Parent
Re:Biggest question (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:Biggest question (Score:4, Funny)
Where did he get the Deuterium from?
It's like this: You take two frisbies, a remote control toy truck, and a bottle of shampoo, and wait for a stormy night...
Parent
Re:Well done (Score:4, Interesting)
Put away the fear-mongering, and learn to use Google. Deuterium is easily obtained from many places for *gasp!* science experiments.
http://unitednuclear.com/hw.htm [unitednuclear.com]
http://www.isotope.com/cil/products/displayproduc
And the world's leading "producer" of Deuterium is Canada.
Parent