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Intel Preps Mac mini Look-Alike
Posted by
samzenpus
on Tue May 31, 2005 07:03 AM
from the small-computing dept.
from the small-computing dept.
boarder8925 writes "From Wired: 'A new Wintel prototype that openly apes Apple Computer's popular Mac mini is due out this week, giving Intel a showcase to prove its chips are a match for anyone when it comes to tiny PC designs. Working prototypes of the Mac mini look-alike running Microsoft Windows and based on Intel's Pentium M CPU have already been built by Taiwan PC maker AOpen at Intel's request, according to two sources in Taiwan's PC manufacturing industry who have seen them.' This isn't the non-working box Slashdot covered earlier."
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OK (Score:5, Insightful)
The main reason for a small box is so it can be put on show, thus style and design need to be seen to make a judgement.
Re:OK (Score:3, Funny)
Unless its priced WAY cheaper than a MiniMac, what's the point? Why not get the real deal?
Re:OK (Score:5, Insightful)
Just because Apple already did it, doesn't mean no one else should ever try.
Parent
Re:OK (Score:4, Insightful)
That's why I can't stand all this about a Mac Mini look-alike from Intel. Unless it runs OS X, then you shouldn't even use the term "Mac Mini" anywhere in the article. It's just a small form factor PC. I can't think of anyone who would put a small form factor Wintel box in the same trade space as a Mac Mini. Unless you like to compare apples and oranges in your spare time...
Parent
Re:OK (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:OK (Score:5, Interesting)
Parent
Re:OK (Score:4, Insightful)
If Apple ever releases OSX/ia32 and/or OSX/ia64, a LOT of people will buy it and start dual-booting their windows boxes, instead of buying the non-existent Longhorn.
Parent
Re:OK (Score:3, Interesting)
There were even low profile Alpha systems.
Welcome to the age of innovation (Score:4, Funny)
It won't be a Mac mini lookalike... (Score:5, Funny)
I kid, I kid. I own a Mac myself.
Re:It won't be a Mac mini lookalike... (Score:5, Funny)
After all, if it's running Windows:
... give it a few days, it WILL be non-working.Parent
Re:It won't be a Mac mini lookalike... (Score:4, Insightful)
So, where are thes zombie hordes of Mini Macs that the phishers/spammers/etc are controlling? Oh, right, they don't exist. Its a Windows-only "feature".
But since you brought it up, where are the hordes of Linux zombies?
If you're going to troll, at leas[tt] do it right ... sheesh!
Parent
Competition (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Competition (Score:4, Funny)
I'd like to see Intel one-up Apple and utilize the same hardware for an open laptop spec. Imagine not having to pay $900 to get a 14.1" LCD repaired. Imagine the modding that would come along.
As a side note, I propose a new unit of volume - the MM. Not to be confused with the linear measurement 'mm' (millimeter), MM will stand for Mac Mini. So if something is 1.3MM, then it is 1.3x the volume of a Mac Mini.
That seems to be the new standard. We could use this with LoCps (Libraries of Congress per second).
Parent
Re:Competition (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Competition (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm not going to bother to respond to your comments about iLife as you've clearly never even used it. I hope all those megahertz help you do what you need to do.
Still, you can't even be bothered to reach for the shift key, so you probably couldn't enjoy the subtleties of functionality that iLife offers.
Parent
Re:Competition (Score:4, Insightful)
Oh, and being an intel clone, this thing better be $249 out the door, including a DVD reader / CD burner and a copy of Windows XP. Think it'll happen? Probably not. They didn't even take advantage of the Mac Mini's one missing feature - S-Video out. I think that's a power port, not the elusive TV connection.
Parent
Re:Competition (Score:5, Informative)
Mac mini: $500 (give or take)
DVI to SVIDEO adapter for Mac mini: $19
Posting this for the 30000th time: Priceless
Parent
Re:Competition (Score:3, Informative)
what's top stop them from using integrated nvidia? that's light years faster than the POS ati 9600 in the mini.
and i _have_ a mini. this thing is _not_ fast.
why does it have to be $249 out the door? the mini's lowest end is $499.
they could easily do a $499 x86 mini pc with all the trimmings _and_ a copy of windows xp. hell you can get a full desktop pc with lcd monitor, keyboard, mouse, dual layer dvd burner, 80gb hd, 512mb ram, 2.66ghz p4, speakers and windows xp [dell.com] for $5
Re:Competition (Score:4, Informative)
The thing is; look at the rear of a mac mini; no digital audio out, no TV-friendly output.
Why do people not take the hint? The mini is NOT designed to work with a TV, it is lacking ALL of the elements you would want. That doesn't make it designed for the TV, but lacking: it make it what it is; a cheap, no integrated display, desktop computer that runs OS X. Nothing more.
And for that job, its pretty good; it seriously dropped the minimum price of entry for OS X. Job done, design complete.
Parent
Re:Competition (Score:4, Informative)
As somebody who is using his Mac mini as a high def PVR and media center on a 199" screen, I can say without hesitation that Anandtech's review is full of shit.
Using the El Gato EyeTV, it works like a champ for both recording and playback of either 720p or 1080i signals.
Also, the DVD player in 10.3 works very well, and the new DVD player for Tiger is even better.
The only complaint I have (and it's a nitpick) is that the deinterlace software is not that great, which is a problem when watching cheaply-made interlaced DVD's (such as some anime TV show disks.) That's easy enough to get around, thanks to VLC.
(The new Tiger DVD Player does have some deinterlace control, but so far nothing that works nearly as well as the better filter options on VLC.)
Parent
Photos (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Photos (Score:3, Informative)
Silver + beige = $$ (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Intel's killer application (Score:3, Funny)
built in hotplate and griddle for 3D in-game snacks (running solitare turns it into a plate warmer)
Apple isn't bothered but George Foreman better start worrying
Not cool :-( (Score:5, Interesting)
Wrong priorities (Score:5, Insightful)
Frankly, other than die-hard nerds, noone gives a damn about the OS. The point that all the "Linux rules, Windows blows" or "MacOS rules, everything else blows" flamewars are missing is just that: that the OS itself is really the least important part.
In the real world what matters is what can you _do_ with a tool, and the computer or OS are just such tools to an end. What matters is what concrete goals can you achieve with it, not what a cool Apple logo it has on the box. What Joe Average asks is stuff like "Can I edit my digital photos with it and burn them on a CD"? What Joe is seeking just a solution to some clear problems, never "but I really wanted to try Linux, although I have no clue wth will run on it, or what can I do with it".
That solution means: apps. And the OS exists only to load those apps. Most people would run any OS just as gladly without an OS, if they could just pop the CD in and have the application start up.
Don't believe me? Look at the some 100 million game consoles sold, and how noone said "nah, if it doesn't show a Windows boot-up screen I'm not buying a PS2". What they _did_ however ask is: "what games are available on it, then?" I.e., they asked about the _apps_.
That's it. The apps are the alpha, omega, and the whole alphabet in between.
So all this OS brand zealotry is really like saying you buy only a certain brand of car for the dashboard, and not to actually drive it. Or better yet, saying that you're buying a microwave oven instead of a fridge because you like the interface more. It's... missing the point, to put it very diplomatically.
_Noone_ other than geeks will want to buy a computer for Linux or any other OS. In the real world they'll buy it for what they can do with that box.
Tell them "yeah, you can get this machine and you'll have a cheap, secure and very easy to use computer, that can edit your digital photos, surf the web, encode and decode movies and music, etc" and you'll have the people's attention. That's what Apple did. _That_ is the message that people want to hear.
But tell them "give me your money to try a new OS that exists just to fight MS's evil empire", and you've lost them. _Noone_ sane blows their paycheck just to fight in some idealistic nerd rebellion.
Parent
No one emulates bad ideas... (Score:5, Insightful)
I guess eventually people reach the point where they begin to treat their computers more as appliances and less as sandboxes to play in; upgrading video cards, hard drives, and processors whenever the latest hot game is released. When I use a computer these days, I'm either modifying content I've created (pictures, movies), browsing the web, or logging into a shell at work to catch up on my tasks. I don't need a GeForce 6800 GT and a 4 GHz hyper-pipelined processor to do that.
Clunky. (Score:5, Insightful)
Few dobut that Intel's chips have the same potential for minturization as Apple's chips. Yet somehow it seems that 90% of all mini PC's and PC laptops out there still look like concrete slabs when compared with the Mac mini and the PowerBooks which has caused a not inconsiderable number of consumers to begin regarding the PC's as clumsy. Apple concluded that style and ultra compactness matters to some consumers more than raw computing power and apparently they were not entirely wrong. For a Mac user it is certainly satisfying to see Intel finally acknowledging that.
Mini-market (Score:4, Interesting)
I think Intel is better off with the normal PC market. For the same price you can get way more out of a normal PC. Apple might make a little money off the Mini mostly because the Mini looks trendy and that drives a lot of Mac sales.
The Mini design might start looking good for a media PC that would sit on top of a TV, but until there is a way to add way more storage for DVR and storing DivX, they won't cut it. Also, I am guessing the GPU in it won't play HD quality very well.
Intel might be a little better off enlarging the size, but adding more power to it. Call it the "Almost-mini" and sell it as a faster solution.
Just one size to small (Score:4, Interesting)
If you are looking for a good office solution look at the ASUS Pundit [asus.com.tw]. They don't get hot, have space for a decent harddisk and DVD drive and are very efficient with desk space (especially when used with a flatscreen and wireless keyboard)
Re:Just one size to small (Score:4, Informative)
Parent
Apple doesn't just throw components into a box (Score:5, Insightful)
There have always been Mac lookalikes. Remember the eOne from eMachines.
Apart from press interest at their introduction, all of them sank in the marketplace without so much as a ripple.
Anyone who says that there is much difference overall in price or power between a Mac and a PC is grinding an axe. The fact is they're using technologies that are pretty much on a par and the price/performance is pretty much on a par.
But the Wintel Bizarro-world Mac-alike machines usually ARE overpriced and underpowered. And the form factor and "look" usually look like a cheesy knockoff; it's obvious they are not using industrial designers of the caliber that Apple uses.
Love it or hate it, the original iMac, for example, showed an amazing design integrity in carrying the "translucency" theme throughout the entire design; not only the case, but the keyboard, the mouse, _and the power cord_ were translucent. I'll bet those power cords added cost. That's the sort of detail the would-be Mac-alikes never seem to include.
It's the overall integrity of the product design that gives Apple that "wow" factor. It's also the overall integrity of the product design that makes Apple's products so comfortable and usable.
So, someone else can throw just as many components into a little box as Apple can? I never doubted it for a second. The point is, Apple doesn't just throw components into a box.
Re:Apple doesn't just throw components into a box (Score:4, Insightful)
Errr...can you say "G4 Cube"?
Parent
Are we supposed to be impressed? (Score:3, Insightful)
This is the sort of tactic would I expect from a no-name box-shifter, not a supposed market leader in technology. The Mac Mini makes sense as a switcher's 1st Mac, as a cheap means to play with OSX, or as a design Icon (with an expensive pretty Apple LCD, wireless keyboard and mouse) in a high-tech setting, but this box has none of those factors in it's favour.
The only market for a small and pretty 'PC mini' that sacrifices upgradability for size is as a media centre, which puts this box into direct competition with those other recently announced small-box media centres the Xbox360 and PS3, where it's going face insurmountable competition on spec, price, and availability of games. If Intel really had the right stuff to be in this market would all 3 next gen boxes (and the Mac Mini for that matter) be using a different processor supplier?
Time to ditch the slogan 'intel inside' in favour of 'too little too late'?
Re:Are we supposed to be impressed? (Score:4, Informative)
so its not intel that's playing knock-off -- it's apple.
Parent
Re:Are we supposed to be impressed? (Score:5, Interesting)
PS I thought the mini was a good enough idea that I seriously looked into getting one as a 'stepping stone' out of the Wintel world...couldn't quite bring myself to do it, but its a good attempt by Apple to be entry-level friendly. Maybe the next generation or two will be better.
Parent
I didn't by it for its size (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't care if the box is cute and tiny, I want some ability to upgrade the stuff inside it.
Does this mean cheaper Apples? (Score:3, Interesting)
Good news (Score:4, Interesting)
Something like this would be great for sticking in a flat where space is at a premium and/or you want something that looks good and doesn't make a lot of noise.
It would be nice if companies now concentrated on size and quietness rather than mhz. If my next PC was smaller than a shoebox (and just as expandable) then I'd be there in a shot.
Of course I could just get a Mac Mini, but having lots of money invested in PC software, I'm not yet prepared to make the switch.
Mini PC's have been available for a few years (Score:4, Interesting)
http://www.thebookpc.com/index.php/cPath/68_33?os
Mac hardware has always been great, but I will buy which ever is cheaper. Mac Minis (like its mini itx predecessors) are not designed to be incredibly fast, but incredibly small. Their size makes them a nice addition to the home theater system, or pretty much anywhere.
They both run linux, so other than price, there really isn't much difference between them to me.
A pointless exercise? (Score:3, Insightful)
How is this different... (Score:5, Insightful)
Kinda reminds me of the memorial day parade (Score:5, Insightful)
Several things struck me about these cars. First, the overwheliming impression is that they were huge. I bet that Impala weighs more than a Lincoln Navigator, and takes up more road space. Granted, we're only seeing the cars that were somebody's pride and joy; the Novas of this world are all in junk yards. But no doubt, these cars were the dominant automotive species of my childhood.
Second, despite quite a bit of creativity in the application of chrome and paint, to modern eyes these cars are strikingly uniform in their primitiveness. They project ponderous massiveness, not refinement. A modern economy car such as a Honda Civic boasts elegance beyond any but the most luxurious of the 60s cars. SUVs like the Ford Explorer that by modern standards are clumsy and bulky have a lightness and agility that only a sports car of 60s era could match.
My point here is that we're at the end of the muscle car era of computer workstations. We can choose between the equivalent of a massive Plymouth Fury or a "small" alternative like the Chevy Nova. A few odd people are driving the equivalent of the original Beetle, which was too cramped and underpowered for most peoples' tastes. In thirty years or so, we'll look at the computers we use today, and we'll scoff at how inconveniently bulky and primitive they are.
And we'll expect these small, powerful, elegant computers to be far cheaper in real terms.
What Apple has done with the Mini is introduce the equivalent of the Datsun (now Nissan). It was a car that combined economy with refinement, fun and quality. The Japanese invasion of the US car market raised the bar such that there is no comparing a car from 1975 and 1985. Detroit was slow to respond because this kind of innovation wasn't in their business genes, and they paid. Intel is trying to keep its customers from making the same mistake.
Mac OS X? (Score:4, Interesting)
I always thought the biggest advantage with Mac was the OS. Having a Mac Mini lookalike with Windows does not a Mac Mini do. Unless Intel do some serious shaping up on Windows too this is just an ordinary crappy PC with Windows on it in a smaller package.
Re:market (Score:5, Funny)
I am not the guy whose account I am posting this under. I just 0wnz h1s l1nux b0x3n.
Parent
Re:I don't see a point (Score:4, Funny)
Parent
Re:I don't see a point (Score:5, Insightful)
I've had my current computer for 6 years. I've done the RAM upgrade and the HD upgrade. I did a video card upgrade, but that was back when I played games. The video card I bought it with would have been sufficient for most desktop apps. I think that many people don't want to spend $200 every year to upgrade their computer. They just want a computer that's reliable, and that doesn't make excessive noise, or take up excessive space.
Parent
Re:I would buy a Mac mini, if... (Score:4, Insightful)
- addition
-subtraction
-multiplication
-divisio
So it shouldn't cost much more than a typical calculator that I can buy at walmart? Oh, what? It can do lots of other stuff too? You mean it's a whole computer in there? That's why it costs more?
Right, so you want to ignore all the normal computer functionality available in a macmini, replace all that with TiVo functionality, and then buy it for the price of a TiVo? Maybe you're missing the point here. There are a number of companies that sell DVR's, perhaps you should go buy one of those.
Parent
Re:I would buy a Mac mini, if... (Score:3, Funny)
It should be large, have a lot of power, have a lot of towing capacity, 4 tv screens w/ 12 speakers, four wheel drive, and seat 8 people - so I can take it to the grocery store.