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AirPort Express Streaming Audio From Any Program

Posted by Zonk on Tue Mar 01, 2005 02:00 PM
from the showing-off-my-tmbg-collection dept.

Foobaz writes "Until now, the only application that can play audio on Apple's AirPort Express has been Apple's own iTunes. But Rogue Amoeba, makers of Audio Hijack, just released Airfoil, a program that lets you redirect anything to your AirPort Express, like streaming audio from mplayer, RealPlayer, or VLC."

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Tinfoil hats (Score:3, Funny)

by boingyzain (739759) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:02PM (#11814760)

Do I need an airfoil hat to use this?
Sync issues (Score:4, Interesting)

by KoopaTroopa (549540) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:03PM (#11814769) Homepage

Has anyone used this? Are there any sync issues if running audio from (as an example) VLC from a video file?
- Re:Sync issues (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by Elwood P Dowd (16933) <judgmentalist@gmail.com> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:09PM (#11814859) Journal
  
  They answer that question in the FAQ. Yes, the audio will be out of sync. This can be solved with VLC or MPlayer by manually synchronizing the video and audio. This cannot be solved with DVD Player.app, RealPlayer, or anything else that won't let you decouple audio from video. There's probably nothing they can really do about this.
  
  Parent
  - Re:Sync issues (Score:3, Insightful)
    
    by KoopaTroopa (549540)
    
    I figure hopefully there's a kind of standard delay in the Airport Express decoding so, even if you have to manually sync, maybe it's not a trial-and-error process.
    
    Thanks for reading the FAQ for me (page didn't load for me, apparently it wasn't /.'d yet though.
  - Re:Sync issues (Score:4, Interesting)
    
    by Elwood P Dowd (16933) <judgmentalist@gmail.com> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:20PM (#11814989) Journal
    
    There's probably nothing they can really do about this.
    I said that, but it's not true. They could write software that would buffer everything coming out of the compositing engine, or perhaps just one window, and play it back a second or two later. Obviously this would be resource intensive and prone to annoyances, but it could work on big, burly machines.
    
    Parent
- Re:Sync issues (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by JonGretar (222255) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:14PM (#11814924) Homepage
  
  There is a sync issue with this. It's got to do with the APEX standard and nothing the DEV's can do about it.
  
  However. This is not a problem since VLC and MPlayer can move the sound all around. So just watch your torrents with VLC(which I guess you do anyway) and make the sound be a few seconds early. Easy peasy.
  
  More info at http://www.rogueamoeba.com/forum/ubb/Forum7/HTML/0 00010.html [rogueamoeba.com]
  
  Parent
  - Re:Sync issues (Score:3, Insightful)
    
    by pancakegeels (673199)
    
    Easy peasy? I can't get this to work from any command line app. Any ideas?
Crippleware (Score:4, Informative)

by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:04PM (#11814778)

It emits noise after using for ten minutes, unless you purchase the "pro" version
- Re:Crippleware (Score:5, Funny)
  
  by amichalo (132545) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:05PM (#11814798)
  
  It emits noise after using for ten minutes, unless you purchase the "pro" version
  
  That's just your music. Try this site [itunes.com] and see if it helps.
  
  Parent
- Funny? (Score:2, Informative)
  
  by Anonymous Coward
  
  From the site [rogueamoeba.com], under "Buy" on the right:
  
  *Before purchase, noise is overlaid on all transmissions longer than 10 minutes.
- Re:Crippleware (Score:3, Informative)
  
  by SlamMan (221834)
  
  So? Its a demo. It it was fully functional, few people would buy it.
- Re:Crippleware (Score:5, Funny)
  
  by nacturation (646836) <nacturation&gmail,com> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:22PM (#11815010) Journal
  
  Yes, after ten minutes it turns into steaming audio.
  
  Parent
  - - Re:Crippleware (Score:4, Funny)
      
      by nacturation (646836) <nacturation&gmail,com> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:32PM (#11815122) Journal
      
      what, does that mean that it plays raunchy pron over the wireless connection
      
      No, not origasmi. I was thinking more the kind your neighbor's dog carefully arranges on your lawn. Dogs certainly know their feng shuit.
      
      Parent
- - Re:Crippleware (Score:4, Informative)
    
    by SkipRosebaugh (50138) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:46PM (#11815309) Homepage
    
    Sure there is. It's called JustePort [nanocrew.net]
    
    Parent
Still not the only feature I want (Score:5, Interesting)

by Elwood P Dowd (16933) <judgmentalist@gmail.com> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:04PM (#11814780) Journal

I want to be able to use my computer as an AirTunes sink, not a source. I'm not about to buy an Airport Express, but I'd like to be able to pipe audio from my girlfriend's iBook to my desktop's speakers.

Then yeah, I'd like to be able to do it with DVD Player.app as well as iTunes.
- Re:Still not the only feature I want (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by humuhumunukunukuapu' (678704) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:11PM (#11814879)
  
  why not turn on sharing in both of your itunes? then you can access one another's libraries.
  
  Parent
  - - Re:Still not the only feature I want (Score:3, Interesting)
      
      by jacksonj04 (800021)
      
      Shared Library actually works better than AirTunes in this regard - a shared library works irrespective of what each person is doing, unlike AirTunes where iTunes needs to do the work on one machine.
      
      So, with shared library you can both listen to different things!
Will the foil fly? (Score:3, Interesting)

by erick99 (743982) <homerun@gmail.com> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:04PM (#11814783) Homepage

Airfoil looks like a great product,however, I can't quite tell if it is something that Apple will dislike given how proprietary Apple can be.
- Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by isa-kuruption (317695) <kuruption AT kuruption DOT net> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:18PM (#11814974) Homepage
  
  If Apple didn't like it and wanted to be proprietary, they wouldn't have used Real Time Streaming Protocol (RTSP) [rtsp.org], which is a well documented and supported protocol, as the transport method.
  
  Parent
  - Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:3, Interesting)
    
    by beej69 (12003)
    
    huh? do you have any URL's to back up your claim? afaik, apple purposefully used a proprietary algorithm. Jon Lech Johansen (yes... DVD Jon) was the one to reverse-engineer it:
    http://nanocrew.net/blog/apple/revairtunes.html [nanocrew.net]
    - Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:5, Interesting)
      
      by isa-kuruption (317695) <kuruption AT kuruption DOT net> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:37PM (#11815187) Homepage
      
      My claims? Considering Apple uses RTSP for it's Quicktime streaming [rtsp.org] it would only make sense for them to use the thing they know for their other products. Any more proof? Shall I telnet to port 554 on my Airport Express and show you the RTSP signature? How about a Apple Press Release [macobserver.com] in which they updated RTSP in the Airport firmware. I'm sure Apple always updates protocols not supported by their hardware!
      
      Parent
      - Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:5, Informative)
        
        by isa-kuruption (317695) <kuruption AT kuruption DOT net> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:51PM (#11815361) Homepage
        
        As explained in this blog [typepad.com]:
        
        RAOP protocol itself has already been analyzed by DVDJon and its implementation is availabe as an open source C# software called JustePort. RAOP protocol is based on RTSP wrapped with AES and RSA cryptography, on which Apple Lossless files are streamed.
        
        AES and RSA are also open methods in conjunction with RTSP. Seems pretty open to me.
        
        Parent
Okay... (Score:3, Insightful)

by Delta2.0 (846278) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:04PM (#11814786)

That will work nice for those who have airport express, but when will other hardware makers put the ability to stream music to a stereo on their routers so the price won't be such a factor?
OSX-only (Score:2)

by jbellis (142590)

Damn... still waiting to be able to stream from launchcast.
Audio Hijack (Score:3, Interesting)

by mailman-zero (730254) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:06PM (#11814803) Homepage

How do they accomplish this? Is there any sort of conversion on the fly being done to the audio? Are they piping it through iTunes somehow or implementing this on their own? Does this involve encryption algorithms?
- Re:Audio Hijack (Score:3, Informative)
  
  by nguyenhm (577058)
  
  Yes it involves encryption. The signal going to an Airport Express is encrypted Apple Lossless.
- Re:Audio Hijack (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by beej69 (12003) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:24PM (#11815047)
  
  they're the first high-profile implementation of the algorithm that Jon Lech Johansen reverse-engineered:
  (http://nanocrew.net/blog/apple/revairtunes.html [nanocrew.net])
  
  and yes... this is THAT Jon... the one that got yanked into court for reverse-engineering the DVD encryption. all hail Jon! :D
  
  what we need now is for mplayer and VLC and the others to implement airport express streaming directly in the media player...
  
  Parent
Apple's not going to like this. (Score:2, Informative)

by jocknerd (29758)

They don't like to share their toys with outsiders.

Don't flame me. I'm an Apple user. So I know what I speak of.
- Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by SpamJunkie (557825) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:12PM (#11814895)
  
  It probably won't be a problem, for two reasons:
  
  1. It's been in beta for a while, Apple could have easily done something about it earlier.
  
  2. It still uses iTunes. The backend uses the iTunes API to add a local stream to the library and send it to the Airport Express.
  
  What would really make Apple upset is if someone had discovered the key being used to encrypt the audio, but that hasn't happened here.
  
  Parent
  - Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:3, Informative)
    
    by fiji (4544) *
    
    Oh, like what "DVD Jon" did last August: http://nanocrew.net/blog/apple/revairtunes.html [nanocrew.net]
    
    -ben
- Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:3, Insightful)
  
  by useosx (693652)
  
  Apple never had a problem with Audio Hijack. I really see no reason that they're going to think anything other than "Oh, now we'll sell more Airport Expresses."
  
  This is much different than, say, cracking their DRM. I really can't think of a single reason they would disapprove of Airfoil.
- - Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:3, Interesting)
    
    by lpp (115405)
    
    Er, no. Apple loves people to play with their toys but only in Apple approved ways.
    
    I am the developer for QTConvert, an app that just exposes the QuickTime API for format exporting, a feature normally only available for folks who've upgraded to QuickTime Pro. When iTMS first came out, the QuickTime API still supported exporting from Protected AAC to whatever formats were valid targets. However QuickTime Pro had disabled this, by doing a simple check. Since I didn't really care to have my tunes in an encum
RealPlayer!? (Score:3, Funny)

by Tibor the Hun (143056) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:06PM (#11814811)

I think I speak for all of us when I say AWESOME!

Kudos to the hackers though..
Are Airports lossy? (Score:2)

by frenchgates (531731)

Or is the output the same as plugging a cable into the audio out of the computer?
- Re:Are Airports lossy? (Score:5, Funny)
  
  by suso (153703) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:08PM (#11814844) Homepage Journal
  
  Only if you fly with TWA.
  
  Parent
- Re:Are Airports lossy? (Score:4, Informative)
  
  by Elwood P Dowd (16933) <judgmentalist@gmail.com> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:13PM (#11814902) Journal
  
  It's lossless, but there's lag.
  
  Parent
- Re:Are Airports lossy? (Score:2)
  
  by SlamMan (221834)
  
  Nope, audio is compressed via the "Apple Lossless Encoder."
Dishonest marketing (Score:4, Informative)

by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:11PM (#11814883)

Until now, the only application that can play audio on Apple's Airport Express has been Apple's own iTunes.

That is dishonest marketing. JustePort [theregister.co.uk] has been doing that for quite some time. It's even more dishonest when Rogue Amoeba probably relied on JustePort to write the AirFoil.
- Re:Dishonest marketing (Score:3, Interesting)
  
  by steve_bryan (2671)
  
  Did you try to check your claim before making the accusation? If Rogue Amoeba uses an iTunes API to add the audio output as a stream to iTunes then iTunes may be doing all the heavy lifting of conversion to lossless audio, the RSA and AES cryptography, etc. It seems entirely possible that they are just doing audio capture as they always have with their main product and letting Apple do the rest of the work.
  
  Checking facts seems like it would be the right thing to do before casting aspersions. Now pardon me
Or.... (Score:5, Funny)

by MattHaffner (101554) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:18PM (#11814973)

mplayer, RealPlayer, or VLC...

Or... Doom3. Wonder how long it will take for the neighbors to call the cops.
Rogue Rawks (Score:4, Informative)

by mushupork (819735) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:24PM (#11815050)

I purchased Audio Hijack to rip AAR to my iPod (you know... before the election) It was crashing on my iBook however. Rogue's support was great, we went back and forth with emails of things to try for a few days. The conclusion was me getting a new build that cured the problem. YMMV of course, but I'd buy from them again.

This is a completely unsolicited endorsement (a /. rarity)
VLC streaming to AirPort Express (Score:5, Informative)

by divinemac (863847) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:25PM (#11815059)

There is an excellent article on (the excellent site) http://www.macosxhints.com/ [macosxhints.com] regarding how to stream from VLC http://www.videolan.org/ [videolan.org] to iTunes here without any additional 3rd parts apps:
http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20041 023154910602&query=VLC [macosxhints.com]
I've been using this solution for playing DIVX files from my laptop (which is connected to my projector, while the audio is routed to AirPort Express) for some time, and works well, thanks to the author's knowledge, and the power of VLC !
From any program?! (Score:4, Funny)

by Anita Coney (648748) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:57PM (#11815426)

Exactly why would I want to stream audio from Notepad.exe?!
- Re:CAN ANYTHING HELP ME WITH STREAMING VIDEO? (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by SlamMan (221834) <(moc.liamg) (ta) (tigiuqs)> on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:16PM (#11814947)
  
  Sure. Look into the hardware from El Gato [elgato.com].
  
  Parent
- Re:I don't want to troll but: (Score:5, Funny)
  
  by inertia@yahoo.com (156602) * on Tuesday March 01 2005, @02:29PM (#11815099) Homepage Journal
  
  ...considering that only 3% of all computer users use a mac...
  
  When did we get that extra 1%?
  
  Parent
- Re:Is there an equivalent for windows? (Score:3, Informative)
  
  by badasscat (563442)
  
  And also routers that can do this? Its a cool feature that i'd like to have but dont want to switch to macs
  
  I don't know about routers, but you can do what I and a lot of others do and have a media server hooked up to your home theater setup through either wireless or (preferably) wired ethernet (still better than wireless for speed and stability). I'm sure there are probably some NAS devices that can act similarly at a lower cost than a full-fledged PC. I admit that I don't quite "get" what's so specia
  - No need for VNC (Score:3, Informative)
    
    by aclarke (307017)
    
    Hey. In case anybody cares, there really isn't a need for VNC, as long as you're not using Windows 98 on your media server. Or maybe XP Home too. Windows NT-based operating systems (i.e. 2000 & XP Pro) allow you to use Terminal Services as you're doing to get into them. There's a Remote Desktop client available for both Linux and Mac OS X (www.rdesktop.org [rdesktop.org]).
    
    If you're using Linux as your media server, just connect to it using a remote X-Server. It might be a little less intuitive for a Windows us
- Yeah, that iTunes program is wicked expensive (Score:5, Informative)
  
  by reptilicus (605251) on Tuesday March 01 2005, @03:10PM (#11815579)
  
  ---But it requires iTunes, so there's one more thing that I'm not going to buy from apple.---
  
  You do realize that iTunes is free, and works just fine with all sorts of file formats you can rip from your own cd's or buy elsewhere right? It'll even convert your WMA files to AAC.
  
  ---If I buy a Chevy vehicle, I want it to work with any gasoline that's been refined properly. I don't want to buy Chevy gasoline, or gasoline from an "approved Chevy distributor". Same goes for my music... If I buy something that plays music, I just want it to play my goddamned music... Not music from store A, or through service B.----
  
  Sounds pretty much like iTunes fits the bill for you then, as long as you avoid buying music downloads from any seller with proprietary DRM (pretty much everyone selling major label songs for download, Apple included).
  
  --- Until things change, Apple ain't seeing a dime from me.---
  
  You should really stick it to them by downloading it and using it for free then.
  
  Parent
  - - Re:Yeah, that iTunes program is wicked expensive (Score:3, Interesting)
      
      by Theaetetus (590071)
      
      The problem is that I ~have~ downloaded iTunes in the past, and I didn't like it. Apple's software, like their hardware, has many design decisions that are for the benefit of Apple, not me as an end consumer. Even Quicktime is invasive (why the hell do they have that load on startup???).
      Why does Windows load IE's render engine on startup?
      Also, what's invasive about iTunes?
      Audio players are free these days... Winamp, musicmatch, microsoft, apple... Hell, I've even written my own. The fact that they've l
- Re:Gaaah! (Score:3, Funny)
  
  by derubergeek (594673) *
  
  Yeah, when I buy a Chevy vehicle, I want to be able to put a Ford hood on it. And a Lexus navigation system in it. And BMW wheels on it.
  What's that you say? I can't? Proprietary bastards!

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AirPort Express Streaming Audio From Any Program

AirPort Express Streaming Audio From Any Program 50 Comments More Login /

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Tinfoil hats (Score:3, Funny)

Sync issues (Score:4, Interesting)

Re:Sync issues (Score:5, Informative)

Re:Sync issues (Score:3, Insightful)

Re:Sync issues (Score:4, Interesting)

Re:Sync issues (Score:5, Informative)

Re:Sync issues (Score:3, Insightful)

Crippleware (Score:4, Informative)

Re:Crippleware (Score:5, Funny)

Funny? (Score:2, Informative)

Re:Crippleware (Score:3, Informative)

Re:Crippleware (Score:5, Funny)

Re:Crippleware (Score:4, Funny)

Re:Crippleware (Score:4, Informative)

Still not the only feature I want (Score:5, Interesting)

Re:Still not the only feature I want (Score:5, Informative)

Re:Still not the only feature I want (Score:3, Interesting)

Will the foil fly? (Score:3, Interesting)

Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:5, Informative)

Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:3, Interesting)

Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:5, Interesting)

Re:Will the foil fly? (Score:5, Informative)

Okay... (Score:3, Insightful)

OSX-only (Score:2)

Audio Hijack (Score:3, Interesting)

Re:Audio Hijack (Score:3, Informative)

Re:Audio Hijack (Score:5, Informative)

Apple's not going to like this. (Score:2, Informative)

Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:5, Informative)

Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:3, Informative)

Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:3, Insightful)

Re:Apple's not going to like this. (Score:3, Interesting)

RealPlayer!? (Score:3, Funny)

Are Airports lossy? (Score:2)

Re:Are Airports lossy? (Score:5, Funny)

Re:Are Airports lossy? (Score:4, Informative)

Re:Are Airports lossy? (Score:2)

Dishonest marketing (Score:4, Informative)

Re:Dishonest marketing (Score:3, Interesting)

Or.... (Score:5, Funny)

Rogue Rawks (Score:4, Informative)

VLC streaming to AirPort Express (Score:5, Informative)

From any program?! (Score:4, Funny)

Re:CAN ANYTHING HELP ME WITH STREAMING VIDEO? (Score:5, Informative)

Re:I don't want to troll but: (Score:5, Funny)

Re:Is there an equivalent for windows? (Score:3, Informative)

No need for VNC (Score:3, Informative)

Yeah, that iTunes program is wicked expensive (Score:5, Informative)

Re:Yeah, that iTunes program is wicked expensive (Score:3, Interesting)

Re:Gaaah! (Score:3, Funny)

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